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Contextual Theologies - 10/7/2008 7:42:43 PM
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perichoretic
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This post stems from a discussion that began in the current events folder about Rev. Wright and Black Liberation Theology (BLT). While this thread can address some of the specifics of BLT and it's advantages or disadvantages to our task as a Church I wanted to expand the discussion to include any and all contextual theologies. A contextual theology is a theology born out of the midst of a specific context. That context is generally one of oppression. Thus, contextual theologies can include the broader spectrum of Liberation Theology, Black Liberation Theology, Feminist Theology and so on. Contextual theologies are often born from within - that is, they are theologies "on the ground" so to speak - they are not theologies divorced from real life situations and complexities.
With that said, contextual theologies do not have all the answers. Often times they end up perpetuating some of the same problems they sought to address. What sort of problems do you think those might be?
Also, as specifically relating to Rev. Wright: Is he wrong? When all the stuff came out months ago with him and Sen. Obama the media was all a buzz. Most people couldn't get over his brashness and some of the choice words he used. But no one seemed to ask the real piercing question: Is he right? Does he have a point to be made and should we hear it? What does it mean to be a Christian in a world super power? What does it mean to be a WHITE Christian in that world? Is patriotism a virtue of being a good Christian?
These and many other questions can be discussed here. I look forward to your civil input.
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RE: Contextual Theologies - 10/7/2008 7:56:21 PM
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1love1God1way
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Contextual theologies, on their very basis, are eisegetic in nature. Reading one's situation into Scripture is backwards. We need to understand our presuppositions, and do the best we can to pull out of Scripture (exegetic) in the context that it was written (the time, people, culture, history, geography, etc).
This is a good discussion topic. I look forward to seeing how it develops. I'll post more later.
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RE: Contextual Theologies - 10/7/2008 8:04:34 PM
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perichoretic
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Ben-
That is a good point and one of the potential downsides of any contextual theology. While reading one's situation into scripture is certainly backwards it does not necessarily mean that one's situation is not found in scripture and addressed by it (or more importantly, by Jesus Christ). Also, I would want to say that any good theology worth its salt is one that is done on the ground and has practical value and implications. Mere Ivory tower musings or talking about God divorced from the people God has stepped into the midst of is really nothing more than puffed up knowledge that has no real value.
Put that way, one might say that God engaged in the ultimate contextual theology by becoming incarnate, actively engaging us in the muck and mire of this world and identifying with the "least of these." It is in this solidarity and identification with the fallen, the broken, the poor, the needy, the sick, the captives that contextual theologies are born, and as such I think become living parables of what Scripture is hoping to convey to us all along.
thanks for your insight.
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RE: Contextual Theologies - 10/8/2008 12:01:44 AM
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MrFribbles
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I would say that contextual theologies, as you define them, do much more harm than good. If a person builds their beliefs and ideas about God around them, and then, for whatever reason, the social paradigms shift and the context for the theology vanishes, what does that leave them with? Nothin'.
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RE: Contextual Theologies - 10/8/2008 9:13:28 AM
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perichoretic
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quote:
ORIGINAL: MrFribbles
I would say that contextual theologies, as you define them, do much more harm than good. If a person builds their beliefs and ideas about God around them, and then, for whatever reason, the social paradigms shift and the context for the theology vanishes, what does that leave them with? Nothin'.
How would you define contextual theologies?
One does not necessarily "build their beliefs and ideas about God around them" but rather sees God present in them. That is a key distinction, I think. A contextual theology, therefore, arises from the slave being treated like a non-human while their master goes to church on Sunday and prays to this person they call Jesus. We might ask: How does a black slave call on the very name of the one used to put them in bondage? What is going on when a black slave calls on the name of Jesus? What is it they are identifying with in Jesus Christ that allows them to make such a confession?
It is out of these sorts of contexts that liberation theologies arise. If we take away the economic structure of slavery (which is still present in varying degrees) that does not mean God is not who God is and was in the midst of that context. While one particular subject may no longer be a slave held in bondage by a master there are plenty of people still in bondage with whom this God is ever present. So in this sense, I would disagree that sould the context of an individual of even a group change that one is left with "nothing." They are left with a profound truth of who this God is and what this God seeks to do.
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RE: Contextual Theologies - 10/8/2008 10:18:03 AM
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MrFribbles
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quote:
I would disagree that sould the context of an individual of even a group change that one is left with "nothing." They are left with a profound truth of who this God is and what this God seeks to do.
But that truth is shaded from past experience, not absolutes. It seems to me that they would only be learning on small aspect of God, in a way that is personally beneficial to them and what makes them feel better. Also, I fear that hanging onto a "liberation" mentality could cause some to hang on to bitterness that is no longer just.
_____________________________
You're a door without a key,
A field without a fence.
You've made a holy fool of me,
And I've thanked you ever since.
- Aaron Weiss
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RE: Contextual Theologies - 10/8/2008 2:44:26 PM
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Ezra
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Oppression and slavery were facts of life when Christ walked this earth. However, His message was not geared to the oppressors so much as to all sinners. Oppression and slavery are the by-products of sin. Therefore contextual theologies do not provide the genuine answers that men need.
At the same time, Christians in a democracy have a right and a responsibility to express themselves and seek to bring justice and truth into the political and civil arenas. That should not change their theology in the least, since we are commanded to be salt and light in this world.
The truth is that all these so-called contextual theologies are lies at heart, since they seek to provide humanistic solutions to problems which only God can deal with -- the redemption and transformation of sinners.
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And whosoever will, let him take the Water of Life freely. Revelation 22:17
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RE: Contextual Theologies - 10/13/2008 8:49:39 AM
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floydette
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quote:
ORIGINAL: perichoretic
How would you define contextual theologies?
One does not necessarily "build their beliefs and ideas about God around them" but rather sees God present in them. That is a key distinction, I think. A contextual theology, therefore, arises from the slave being treated like a non-human while their master goes to church on Sunday and prays to this person they call Jesus. We might ask: How does a black slave call on the very name of the one used to put them in bondage? What is going on when a black slave calls on the name of Jesus? What is it they are identifying with in Jesus Christ that allows them to make such a confession?
It is out of these sorts of contexts that liberation theologies arise. If we take away the economic structure of slavery (which is still present in varying degrees) that does not mean God is not who God is and was in the midst of that context. While one particular subject may no longer be a slave held in bondage by a master there are plenty of people still in bondage with whom this God is ever present. So in this sense, I would disagree that sould the context of an individual of even a group change that one is left with "nothing." They are left with a profound truth of who this God is and what this God seeks to do.
I think you bring up a good point. It is the ability to see how God is present IN each circumstance, and in each culture. It is an amazing journey (for sure) to be able to start to step out of one's own context and see how God is at work in other situations - it certainly expands our image of God I think.
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“The eye sees only what the mind is prepared to comprehend.” Henri Bergson
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RE: Contextual Theologies - 10/13/2008 9:24:20 AM
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rcjames
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It would seem to me that most 'Liberation Theology" is counter Scriptural, in that it is all about not beimg cpmtmet. Scripture indicates something different;
(Heb 13:5) Let your conversation be without covetousness; and be content with such things as ye have: for he hath said, I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee.
And
(1Ti 6:8) And having food and raiment let us be therewith content.
And Paul speaks of himself;
(Php 4:11) Not that I speak in respect of want: for I have learned, in whatsoever state I am, therewith to be content.
And Jesus said;
(Luk 3:14) And the soldiers likewise demanded of him, saying, And what shall we do? And he said unto them, Do violence to no man, neither accuse any falsely; and be content with your wages.
If we have found Christ then we are to be content with that and everything else.
Liberation Theology is twisting the Scriptures (or ignoring them completely) to try and meet a personal and political agenda.
As honorable as it may sound it is not Scripture based.
Thanks
RC
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Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
Read the first chapter of my latest book here;
http://www.deliveranceofsara.com
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RE: Contextual Theologies - 10/13/2008 9:30:10 AM
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floydette
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Hi Rc,
Just curious, in what ways do you see LTheo as not being scripture based?
Thanks,
f
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RE: Contextual Theologies - 10/13/2008 10:20:06 AM
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MrFribbles
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quote:
Just curious, in what ways do you see LTheo as not being scripture based?
What is God's primary concern - our happiness, or His glory?
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You're a door without a key,
A field without a fence.
You've made a holy fool of me,
And I've thanked you ever since.
- Aaron Weiss
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RE: Contextual Theologies - 10/13/2008 10:26:51 AM
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floydette
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Could you clarifiy your position alittle?
Thanks.
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“The eye sees only what the mind is prepared to comprehend.” Henri Bergson
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RE: Contextual Theologies - 10/13/2008 10:36:31 AM
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MrFribbles
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quote:
Could you clarifiy your position alittle?
It seems to me that Liberation Theology is primarily concerned about "What can God do for us?", instead of "What can we do for God?"
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You're a door without a key,
A field without a fence.
You've made a holy fool of me,
And I've thanked you ever since.
- Aaron Weiss
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RE: Contextual Theologies - 10/13/2008 10:51:19 AM
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floydette
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That would be one view. While I do not buy into all parts of LT, I do find understanding contextual theos very helpful to begin to see a more full picture of the gospel. Often times we, in the west, forget to think about the social justice part of God's shalom. Peace, salvation, both include an aspect of social justice. When we see how others are reading scripture, we can start to see things alittle different (hopefully). Each context, heck, each person, has their own perspective when it comes to reading scripture. So, while the west may consider it to be "what can God do for us?", those in latino countries, (coming from a different perspective than us) may very well read the strong social justice theme that scripture contains.
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“The eye sees only what the mind is prepared to comprehend.” Henri Bergson
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RE: Contextual Theologies - 10/13/2008 11:27:45 AM
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rcjames
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quote:
ORIGINAL: floydette
Hi Rc,
Just curious, in what ways do you see LTheo as not being scripture based?
Thanks,
f
Hi, floydette how have you been?
The Scriptures I quoted are all about being satisfied (content) with our situations (Jesus even said our wages), and Liberation Theology is all about being discont and trying to exact a change od onw'a situations. It mignt be an honarable goal, but it is not New Testament based, it is just the opposite.
And when that change is tried to be brought about by extortion or violence (aka Rev. Jackson's policies) then it is not even honorable.
Thank
RC
_____________________________
Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
Read the first chapter of my latest book here;
http://www.deliveranceofsara.com
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RE: Contextual Theologies - 10/13/2008 11:32:28 AM
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floydette
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Thanks rc, I have been good. I hope you have as well!
Are you talking about Black Theo as well as Lib Theo? Just trying to link in Rev. Jackson....
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“The eye sees only what the mind is prepared to comprehend.” Henri Bergson
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RE: Contextual Theologies - 10/13/2008 1:52:28 PM
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rcjames
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quote:
ORIGINAL: floydette
Thanks rc, I have been good. I hope you have as well!
Are you talking about Black Theo as well as Lib Theo? Just trying to link in Rev. Jackson....
I am referrencing all "Liberation Theology", I just used Jackson because most of the readers are familiar wht him.
I spent over 20 years on the mission field and saw a lot of LT at work (most of it under the guise of the Catholic Church. There was revolution, riots, burnings, killings, gun smuggling, etc. all in the name of Christ freeing the huddled masses.
The main theme was "Class Warefare", with religious teachers telling folks that the haves need to be "Brought down" for the benefit of the have-nots. (sounds like and Obama campaign speech or a Rev. Wright sermon to me). It was a constant drum beat of us against them and nothing about the saving (Spiritual) Grace of Christ.
It understandably gave me a very bad taste for "Liberaration Theology" of all sorts.
Thanks
RC
_____________________________
Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
Read the first chapter of my latest book here;
http://www.deliveranceofsara.com
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RE: Contextual Theologies - 10/13/2008 2:16:20 PM
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1love1God1way
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quote:
ORIGINAL: perichoretic
One does not necessarily "build their beliefs and ideas about God around them" but rather sees God present in them.
If this were the case, it wouldn't be so bad, but most contextual theologies are quite the opposite, Black Liberation Theology being the worst in my mind at this.
A few quotes from Cone (essentially, the founder of the BLT movement):
"To put it simply, Black Theology knows no authority more binding than the experience of oppression itself. This alone must be the ultimate authority in religious matters."
"All white men are responsible for white oppression."
"While it is true that blacks do hate whites, black hatred is not racism."
"Black theology refuses to accept a God who is not identified totally with the goals of the black community. If God is not for us, if God is not against white racists, then he is a murderer, and we had better kill him. The task of black theology is to kill gods that do not belong to the black community"
These are not words of a theology. They are words of a political agenda that uses religion as their crutch.
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RE: Contextual Theologies - 10/13/2008 5:04:04 PM
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rcjames
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I guess we could call it "ology" but calling it Theology is really a stretch.
Thanks
RC
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Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
Read the first chapter of my latest book here;
http://www.deliveranceofsara.com
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RE: Contextual Theologies - 10/13/2008 5:22:17 PM
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MrFribbles
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quote:
The main theme was "Class Warefare", with religious teachers telling folks that the haves need to be "Brought down" for the benefit of the have-nots. (sounds like and Obama campaign speech or a Rev. Wright sermon to me). It was a constant drum beat of us against them and nothing about the saving (Spiritual) Grace of Christ.
This is the kind of contextual theology I was speaking against as well (though RC did, of course, phrase it better). Obviously Christianity is not just about getting people to heaven, but if we ignore the rest of Scripture in favor of social reforms, we miss the message of Scripture just as sorely as those who ignore the social action all together.
_____________________________
You're a door without a key,
A field without a fence.
You've made a holy fool of me,
And I've thanked you ever since.
- Aaron Weiss
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RE: Contextual Theologies - 10/13/2008 7:41:59 PM
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GrahamCracker
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The Liberation Theology of Jeremiah Wright promotes a shared interest of his fellow black man (Louis Farrakhan and Malcom X) over the brotherhood of his Christian fellows (white). While Farrakhan and Malcom X are Black Muslims, he had no interest in seeing them come to Christ. I have heard Jeremiah Wright's statements.
So whatever he believes, it isn't biblical. His whole theology is about racial division, not about coming together and healing wounds.
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Larry
Sure we're under the law, everybody knows that!
When He said, "A new covenant," He has made the first obsolete. But whatever is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to disappear. (Heb 10:13)
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RE: Contextual Theologies - 10/14/2008 8:42:01 AM
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floydette
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I would be interested in hearing the other side of it. I believe James Cone does a good job explaining it in his book. It doesn't sound like anyone in this thread has spoken to someone of this theological persuasion and therefore understands the other side of this situation. Am I correct, or am I missing something.... Is anyone interested in hearing the other side - "why" people believe this?
Is this a room full of white, western dudes? lol I am guessing so.... 
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“The eye sees only what the mind is prepared to comprehend.” Henri Bergson
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RE: Contextual Theologies - 10/14/2008 4:34:25 PM
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