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Using Photography for outreach - 12/22/2008 11:09:44 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1427
Joined: 1/27/2007
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We've been looking for ways to have more communication with the people of the town in which our church is located. We stumbled on to something that has raised huge interest. We call it "Dogs, Cats & Kids" and it's simply setting up a small studio in our church annex to take free informal portraits of the pets and families of the town's residents.
In our case, I already had the equipment to do this for the church. But, having seen the remarkably positive response from people surrounding our church I'd say that if your church has anyone with a serious interest in photography and an SLR then the investment in equipment to set up a small, informal studio is DEFINITELY worth considering.
We have had very little success in our efforts to reach out to the community in the past. It was difficult to even find common ground in which to begin building a dialog as the entire area settled into either a 'Post-Christian' or 'Mega-Church' climate. But, we noticed that a very high percentage of people in the town had dogs and in talking to these dog owners we realized that their pets were very special to them. So, we decided to offer free photos of the pets in the area surrounding our church. You should see how the faces of the people light up when we make this offer!
This opened the door to also taking informal portraits for families. So, the day after Christmas and New Years Day, we will opening our doors to offer portraits while visiting Grandparent's or grandchildren are in town. We don't pretend that they are going to get professional studio portraits; but, they will definitely be better than most can shoot themselves.
Here are some examples of dog photos shot at our church annex. The second image is cropped just to show the dog. But, the full image is dog and owner.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/27657433@N08/3106742945/in/set-72157611247876802/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/27657433@N08/3107569662/in/set-72157611247876802/
This outreach ministry to our neighbors has been very, very gratifying and is helping to build bonds of real friendship between our church and those to whom we would like to minister.
If anyone is interested, I can post some suggestions for lighting and backdrops that are only moderately expensive ($1000-$1500). It's not cheap. But, we are already seeing how we can use this capability thoughout the entire year to keep in contact with our neighbors. For instance, the black and white images were put up for the publisher of the town newsletter. They are interested in writing about the ministry to the town.
< Message edited by TMeeks -- 12/22/2008 11:20:05 PM >
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: Using Photography for outreach - 1/14/2009 6:27:48 PM
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techne
Posts: 474
Joined: 4/12/2005
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great idea...
so now what?
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The man who does not read good books has no advantage over the man who cannot read them. -Mark Twain
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RE: Using Photography for outreach - 1/14/2009 6:51:55 PM
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Holdcard
Posts: 269
Joined: 1/14/2009
From: Phoenix, Arizona
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I really like the idea seeing how I love to take photos. Are you giving them disks, or are you actually printing the photos out?
Thanks
Holdcard
_____________________________
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If You Want To POPULATE Heaven
You Have To PLUNDER Hell!!
4th Man Ministries
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RE: Using Photography for outreach - 1/14/2009 11:12:48 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1427
Joined: 1/27/2007
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We've been doing a number of things for them.
1. Giving them 8x10s (1+ depending on the session results)
2. Providing a disk with all photos in RAW, Unprocessed JPG, Processed - TIF, Processed - JPG
3. Putting the photos online so they can point their friends to them
4. For families with children we're creating a 13x19 poster(s) in cartoon style
5. For families with children we're creating ElfYourself greeting cards
6. A statement giving them the copyright so that they own the photo files.
All processing is being done on the Canon RAW using Canon's RAW Tool. We color correct, tone correct and crop all images in both 8x10 and 4x6 formats. It's a very fast process and results in optimal images.
If the town were larger we obviously couldn't provide this level for free. But, for a town of 100 homes it's manageable. We wanted to give MUCH more than they expected so that word of mouth would travel faster... and, it's worked.
quote:
ORIGINAL: Holdcard
I really like the idea seeing how I love to take photos. Are you giving them disks, or are you actually printing the photos out?
Thanks
Holdcard
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: Using Photography for outreach - 1/14/2009 11:23:39 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1427
Joined: 1/27/2007
Status: online
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It's a year long project that will allow us to keep in touch with every home in the town over a long period of time. Ultimately, we plan to invite the town's residents to a special program at the church that will have both a broad appeal and a Christian message. It's an artistic community and the event could be a classical/sacred concert or a special artist series.
But, more importantly, it gives us a very tangible way to pray that God will bless each individual in the town. And, the way God blesses people, at the hightest level, is to draw them to Himself. They may never step into our church; but, we trust that many will come to know Him through the prayers behind this effort. We don't care that they become Baptists. We care that they come to know our Lord.
The important thing is to ensure that we are not using this to manipulate people to the benefit of our church; but, from genuine love for them and a desire to be good neighbors.
quote:
ORIGINAL: techne
great idea...
so now what?
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: Using Photography for outreach - 1/16/2009 8:23:32 AM
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Holdcard
Posts: 269
Joined: 1/14/2009
From: Phoenix, Arizona
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: TMeeks
We've been doing a number of things for them.
1. Giving them 8x10s (1+ depending on the session results)
2. Providing a disk with all photos in RAW, Unprocessed JPG, Processed - TIF, Processed - JPG
3. Putting the photos online so they can point their friends to them
4. For families with children we're creating a 13x19 poster(s) in cartoon style
5. For families with children we're creating ElfYourself greeting cards
6. A statement giving them the copyright so that they own the photo files.
All processing is being done on the Canon RAW using Canon's RAW Tool. We color correct, tone correct and crop all images in both 8x10 and 4x6 formats. It's a very fast process and results in optimal images.
If the town were larger we obviously couldn't provide this level for free. But, for a town of 100 homes it's manageable. We wanted to give MUCH more than they expected so that word of mouth would travel faster... and, it's worked.
I don't have all the equipment (or experience) necessary yet to do such a thing. I'm not sure doing this at the same level you are would be prudent. Although we're in a depressed area of town there are a lot of people. Possibly putting the photos on disk and online may work well. I guess if we don't print them out, all I'll really need is a small light kit and some backdrops.
The few photos I have taken for some of our guests were inside the building, they have dark blue curtains separating some of the rooms, we used that as a background. All I had was my SB800 external flash but the photos turned out pretty good and they were very happy with them.
In our situation we're kind of on our own, the church hosts our ministry by providing the building but that's about as far as it goes. The church is getting a little more involved with us so that may be changing (I sure hope so). Any expenditures at this point are going to be our responsibility. Since it's one of my hobbies we don't really mind, but we can't so it all at once.
Thanks for the idea and the information!
Holdcard
_____________________________
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If You Want To POPULATE Heaven
You Have To PLUNDER Hell!!
4th Man Ministries
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RE: Using Photography for outreach - 1/16/2009 11:28:32 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1427
Joined: 1/27/2007
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quote:
I don't have all the equipment (or experience) necessary yet to do such a thing. I'm not sure doing this at the same level you are would be prudent. Although we're in a depressed area of town there are a lot of people. Possibly putting the photos on disk and online may work well. I guess if we don't print them out, all I'll really need is a small light kit and some backdrops.
To start, you don't even need a light kit. You just need to add some things to what you currently have and build from there. Remember, all you have to accomplish is giving them something better than what they can do on their own.
quote:
The few photos I have taken for some of our guests were inside the building, they have dark blue curtains separating some of the rooms, we used that as a background. All I had was my SB800 external flash but the photos turned out pretty good and they were very happy with them.
That means that you gave them better pictures than they can do at home. Now, all you have to do is tweek things a bit to take it to the next level. Let's start with the blue curtains and SB800. They are perfect. If you have room, move the subjects away from the blue curtains at least 6 feet to minimize shadows.
As for the SB800, you want to get it off your camera. If you have a D80, then you can drive the SB800 from the camera with the SB800 off of the camera wirelessly. If not, all you need to do is to buy an inexpensive tripod ($29), and a TTL extension cord (49.95) . The idea is to move the SB800 away from the camera and higher than the subject's heads. If you want to really improve the SB800 with a modest investment add a Gary Fong LightSphere for $39-$49. You will be amazed at the improvement of your images.
Another potential light modifier that is a great investment is the Photek Softlighter. It's an umbrella that pretends it's a softbox. It will work with your SB800 if you buy a $29 umbrella adapter.
quote:
In our situation we're kind of on our own, the church hosts our ministry by providing the building but that's about as far as it goes. The church is getting a little more involved with us so that may be changing (I sure hope so). Any expenditures at this point are going to be our responsibility. Since it's one of my hobbies we don't really mind, but we can't so it all at once.
Every situation is different. But, as you can see by the small steps above that reap big rewards in terms of picture quality you don't have to go bankrupt to use photography in your ministry.
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: Using Photography for outreach - 1/17/2009 4:13:18 PM
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Holdcard
Posts: 269
Joined: 1/14/2009
From: Phoenix, Arizona
Status: offline
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My understanding and experience with equipment is limited. I understand the basics, light is my friend.
Here's my setup.
D300
SB800
Strobe mount
TTL cable
AF-S VR Zoom-NIKKOR 24-120mm f/3.5-5.6G IF-ED
Since I've never used any external lighting before, I'm not sure what you're suggesting. What would I need to buy? (My TTL cable is only about 1-2 feet)
As long as there are directions in the box(s) I'll probably be able to figure it out, I just don't know where to start but you sure have my attention.
Thanks a bunch for the suggestions, insight and guidance.
Holdcard
_____________________________
---
If You Want To POPULATE Heaven
You Have To PLUNDER Hell!!
4th Man Ministries
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RE: Using Photography for outreach - 1/19/2009 10:39:27 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1427
Joined: 1/27/2007
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Holdcard
My understanding and experience with equipment is limited. I understand the basics, light is my friend.
Here's my setup.
D300
SB800
Strobe mount
TTL cable
AF-S VR Zoom-NIKKOR 24-120mm f/3.5-5.6G IF-ED
You are a long way to where you want to be. You have great equipment. The SB800 IS an external lighting tool. While it can be mounted on the camera, you have the means to mount it OFF camera with the strobe mount and cable.
But, a light stand will help lift it higher and a little farther away from the camera. A stand can cost as little as $30. REI, the outdoor sports retailer, sells waterproof bags for kayaking very inexpensively and you can fill these bags with sand or stones to help keep the stand from being pulled over by the TTL cord.
In this photo, you can see the REI bags being used to anchor light stands. You'll also see light modifiers that soften the output of the strobes. The ones in this picture are fairly expensive. But, you do NOT need that level of product.
But, you WILL need something to soften the output of your flash. In this next picture, you can see a set of lower cost lights that work as well as the expensive ones in the 1st image. But, what you really want to pay attention to is the light modifier in the picture on the light to the left. It's called a Softlighter. And, basically it's an umbrella with a white cloth cover that works much light the Octodomes in the first image. They can be purchased for about $59+ depending on the size you need.
The great thing is that while you see it mounted on a studio strobe, it's really designed to be used with your SB800. Here is an image that shows how the 'sock' stretches to fit around any light. You do need a $29 umbrella adaptor for the light stand. The SB800 fits on it.
Yes, it's a bit of an investment.
$30 - Stand
$29 - Umbrella attachment (Mounts the SB800 on the stand)
$59 - Softlighter
Total = $118
But, what you get is studio quality softness from your SB800. Over time you can add additional slave flashes and lightstand/Softlighters. But, just this one can be used to begin getting MUCH better portrait style shots. Here is an image showing the even lighting of the Softlighter. Notice the eveness of the background lighting and the soft highlights on the end table.
quote:
Since I've never used any external lighting before, I'm not sure what you're suggesting. What would I need to buy? (My TTL cable is only about 1-2 feet)
As long as there are directions in the box(s) I'll probably be able to figure it out, I just don't know where to start but you sure have my attention.
Thanks a bunch for the suggestions, insight and guidance.
Holdcard
The trick is to experiment and build slowly. Go to http://www.strobist.blogspot.com/ for a LOT of free information. Interestingly, they are showing the Softlighter being used on a strobe bracket!
< Message edited by TMeeks -- 1/19/2009 10:45:29 PM >
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: Using Photography for outreach - 1/20/2009 2:36:34 PM
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PolarBear
Posts: 449
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: San Antonio
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Hi TMeeks, I've been out for a while but popped in. This is a great idea! It sounds like right along the lines of the kind of thing my church would like to do. We aim to "reach out" to San Antonio, but not necessarily with all "Christian" events. I think I will mention this to the leaders at some point.
Previously I had thought of another possible way to use photography for ministry -- fund raising. Groups going on, say, missions trips could take pictures for $10 or whatever to help raise money.
_____________________________
Tip of the day: "You" has three letters, not one. It is spelled Y-O-U.
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RE: Using Photography for outreach - 1/20/2009 3:33:50 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1427
Joined: 1/27/2007
Status: online
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Hi PolarBear! It's great to see you here! Just the person I was thinking about when starting this thread! 
The local fire department uses portraits for fundraising and since they've been doing it for years, it must bring in income.
Having done this for a while, I can see that the primary value is the ability to communicate with the surrounding neighbors on a regular basis with a contact that is neutral. This then results in a an in-person contact that becomes quite friendly and personal. There is real building of bonds if the photographic team makes an effort to do an indepth and fun photo session. From there, the trust is built on which spiritual conversations can be explored.
The last photo shoot ended in our being able to pray with and for the dog owner. So, while it's a non-theological environment it can lead to openings for immediate ministry. It was wonderful.
From a technical perspective, with your XSi, the Softlighter was a great find. It really comes close enough to the Octodome's performance to be very useful with the EX580 or EX430, etc. A bare flash is virtually useless. Another thing I've found with the XSi is that removing any filter helps with focus issues, if you have any. Finally, with regards to your particular camera, going into the menu and setting the flash sync to 200 makes a HUGE improvement.
If your church decides to do this and is willing to invest in some low-cost studio lights, the Interfit EXD200 set is much better than the EX150 set. The difference, besides the additonal power, is the digital readout on the EXD200. 200 watt seconds is more than enough for family portraits.
Back to the concept of repeat contacts with the neighbors using free portraits as the anchor, we are delivering 300 'Warm-up' packages to the homes in the area next weekend. In each package there is a cup, a package of hot chocolate, some foil wrapped chocolate hearts. Alone, this might have some impact or could simply be confusing to people. But, we've printed a postcard to go along with it that says:
quote:
Be Your Family’s Valentine for Generations
Saint Valentine’s Day has been celebrated for hundreds of years as a time for warm thoughts in the middle of the cold of winter. Chocolate has always been associated with this celebration of romance, so we would like to offer you this cocoa and chocolates to warm your heart. As our February gift to you, we also want to extend a special offer to adult singles and couples to come to the Glen Echo Baptist Church Annex on University for a free 8 x 10 Valentine Portrait.
Create a gift of love to your family… a portrait of you that they can treasure for generations to come.
The portrait studio will be open from 5:30pm to 9:00pm on February 11th, 12th, and 13th. No appointment required
This is the face of the postcard.
This card provides a rationale for the hot cocoa 'kindness ministry'. The same could be done for giving out frisbees with the church's name and address on it. In this case we could advertise taking photos of dogs playing in the wide areas of the town where the people exercise their pets. This kind of thing can be used for a year long campaign of communicating with the people surrounding the church.
quote:
ORIGINAL: PolarBear
Hi TMeeks, I've been out for a while but popped in. This is a great idea! It sounds like right along the lines of the kind of thing my church would like to do. We aim to "reach out" to San Antonio, but not necessarily with all "Christian" events. I think I will mention this to the leaders at some point.
Previously I had thought of another possible way to use photography for ministry -- fund raising. Groups going on, say, missions trips could take pictures for $10 or whatever to help raise money.
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: Using Photography for outreach - 1/20/2009 9:38:46 PM
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Holdcard
Posts: 269
Joined: 1/14/2009
From: Phoenix, Arizona
Status: offline
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Thanks for all the great information. I've got some homework to do and some experimentation too. I'd be more than willing to invest that much in lighting, could do some more if necessary. Would that setup work well for macro images too? I have a light tent and some lamps, but I'm missing something (education and experience comes to mind).
Do you use a primary lens for your portraits?
Thanks again, a fountain of information!
Holdcard
If you want to go to our gallery, just follow the link in my signature. It goes to the food ministry but once your in the gallery you can go to the main page and see everything.
_____________________________
---
If You Want To POPULATE Heaven
You Have To PLUNDER Hell!!
4th Man Ministries
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RE: Using Photography for outreach - 1/20/2009 10:47:28 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1427
Joined: 1/27/2007
Status: online
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You're getting great images in a huge area. Nice job!
I have a Canon 450D (XSi) and I use either a 24-70mm f2.8L or a 100mm f2.8 macro for portraits. When I get the 5D MKII, I'll probably go to a 70-200mm f2.8L instead of the 24-70.
While the 100m prime has some advantages, the zoom is SO convenient and the 24-70L is a wonderful lens in both sharpness and rich color.
The lighting set that I've been describing is perfect for product or moderate closeup photography like jewelry or small sculptures. My daughter's work is generally only about 4" tall and for most of her photos I used Medium to Large softboxes. The bigger the light in relationship to the object, the softer and more even the light.
Set the lights very close for closeup work.
It will definitely work better than a tent. I've tried all sorts of tents and I've not found any that I've been happy with. They cut the shadows; but, kill the character of the lighting. The next time I'm in the studio I will shoot something small for you. In the meantime, here is an image I shot about 8 years ago with 2 photoflex medium softboxes and one overhead small softbox. I could never get this kind of lighting control with a tent. Fleurette is just 3.5" tall.
As far as the education goes, I've benefitted tremendously by the Web Photo School.
quote:
ORIGINAL: Holdcard
Thanks for all the great information. I've got some homework to do and some experimentation too. I'd be more than willing to invest that much in lighting, could do some more if necessary. Would that setup work well for macro images too? I have a light tent and some lamps, but I'm missing something (education and experience comes to mind).
Do you use a primary lens for your portraits?
Thanks again, a fountain of information!
Holdcard
If you want to go to our gallery, just follow the link in my signature. It goes to the food ministry but once your in the gallery you can go to the main page and see everything.
< Message edited by TMeeks -- 1/20/2009 10:59:34 PM >
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: Using Photography for outreach - 1/21/2009 5:26:07 PM
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Holdcard
Posts: 269
Joined: 1/14/2009
From: Phoenix, Arizona
Status: offline
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Thanks for the link (and the compliments).I may sign up for those courses. Let me ask you this, will these courses fill in the gaps for me. I usually find myself in a strange place education wise. For instance, a Windows for dummies book does me little or no good at all but if I pick up a tech manual I"m kind of lost. I've found myself in the same situation with photography.
I realize it will take a while but I'm pretty serious about learning. Getting the shot is fun for me and my wife too. I've learned so much over the last several years my quality has improved greatly.There's always room for improvement no matter how good you get. I already do some of the photography for special events at our work. I'd like to be able to do an outreach like you described, the church that hosts our food ministry has been trying to generate some interest in the neighborhood for a long time now. This is a great idea.
Thanks again.
Holdcard
_____________________________
---
If You Want To POPULATE Heaven
You Have To PLUNDER Hell!!
4th Man Ministries
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RE: Using Photography for outreach - 1/22/2009 12:00:07 AM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1427
Joined: 1/27/2007
Status: online
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Hi Holdcard,
The WebPhotoSchool is broadly based. So, I am sure that you will find things that are useful at whatever level you find yourself at any given time.
But, before spending a dime make sure that the church is committed actually doing outreach over an extended time and that you have the time and funds to put into the deliverables and expendibles. If the answer is yes on both counts then I encourage you to take the next step and look over the WebPhotoSchool to learn how lighting is done.
As I said as I started this thread, we did not have a single person coming to our church from our town and the only contact we had with the people and leadership of the town seemed to be when they had complaints about something. It was NOT what I would call a cordial relationship and some of the reasons behind it fell squarely on the shoulders of the church.
But, in the month or so that we've been offering the portraits this has happened. Last Sunday I learned that the man I'd just met and I had a mutual friend that had died some years ago as an alcoholic. And, he had appreciated my father-in-laws ministry to his friend. The outcome is that before he left the photo shoot was able to pray with him and enourage him to visit our church.
Then as he was leaving I saw the woman across the street and asked her when I was going to be able to photograph her dog. She replied that it would be a while because she'd just had knee surgery in both knees. We are now able to pray for this woman and the pastor's wife can contact her to see if there is any way we can help with errands, etc. We would not have know about her surgery had the dog photos not been the catalyst for the conversation.
But, here is the thing that really spoke to my heart. The very first people we photographed was a young couple with a small child. They wanted a picture to use for their Christmas card. Now that we are set up to do more formal photos, I contacted the young woman to invite her back to create a Valentine Card for the grandparents from the baby. She wrote back that the child was to have surgery on Friday to correct a deformity of the skull and asked that we pray for them. Had we not made the contact through the photos we would not have known about the surgery and been able to pray for them. I'd like to ask for you to pray for Julie, Matt and Gibson, the baby having the operation.
No, it's not bringing in hordes of people to join the church. But, it IS providing opportunity for deep ministry in the lives of those around our church on a very personal level. And, for that I am grateful, thnaking God for allowing me to be a part of His work in their lives.
This week we will be handing out 250-300 cups with an invitation for free photos in February. As the month progresses I'll keep you updated. In the meantime, lets cover as many practical and technical issues as you'd like to pursue.
quote:
ORIGINAL: Holdcard
Thanks for the link (and the compliments).I may sign up for those courses. Let me ask you this, will these courses fill in the gaps for me. I usually find myself in a strange place education wise. For instance, a Windows for dummies book does me little or no good at all but if I pick up a tech manual I"m kind of lost. I've found myself in the same situation with photography.
I realize it will take a while but I'm pretty serious about learning. Getting the shot is fun for me and my wife too. I've learned so much over the last several years my quality has improved greatly.There's always room for improvement no matter how good you get. I already do some of the photography for special events at our work. I'd like to be able to do an outreach like you described, the church that hosts our food ministry has been trying to generate some interest in the neighborhood for a long time now. This is a great idea.
Thanks again.
Holdcard
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: Using Photography for outreach - 1/22/2009 11:59:33 AM
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Holdcard
Posts: 269
Joined: 1/14/2009
From: Phoenix, Arizona
Status: offline
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I think we're on the same page Biblically speaking. It's not about numbers or church membership, the goal is to introduce people to the one true God using the anointing He's given you. Can't speak for everyone, but the path God chose for me was a total surprise. People think I'm kidding or trying to be extra spiritual when I say I just show up and watch God work. It really is true in any ministry endeavor God has placed me in. My responsibility is to show up and do the bull work, then God handles the spiritual aspects. I'm always amazed.
As far as the church being committed, I'm not sure how that will work. They talk a lot, but little gets done (not a judgment, just a fact). So I will move ahead under the assumption that I will be footing the bill myself, if they help out it's just an added blessing and I will be happy about it.
I will probably sign up for the classes you mentioned, although I looked all the things you recommended up I still don't completely understand how to use them all in unison. Once I complete a few of the classes it may make a lot more sense to me. I'll try to start with the basics and work my way up with the classes, I may have some questions along the way. How do you feel about starting a new thread so we don't muddy this one up. Although this conversation is sort of on topic it really doesn't relate that well to your original post. A how to thread may help others as well.
Photography is my personal hobby, I do it for relaxation. I've found that God gives me talents for His glory, my enjoyment is just a benefit of obedience.
Thanks again for all your wisdom, it's fun watching God work isn't it !!
Hodlcard
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If You Want To POPULATE Heaven
You Have To PLUNDER Hell!!
4th Man Ministries
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RE: Using Photography for outreach - 1/22/2009 3:01:15 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1427
Joined: 1/27/2007
Status: online
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Actually, this IS the best thread for going into the technical aspects of lighting, etc that are required for this project. There is another thread in the "Ministry Leaders" section that is dealing with the aspects of outreach using this type of ministry.
So, if you are interested, I would be more than willing to create some movies describing the lighting techniques you would use and how various types of equipment might help you. If you are willing to continue the dialogue top see how it progresses then I would love to do so. it's not rocket science and with the introduction of affordable lighting alternatives, it is within the reach of any ministry that has anyone interested in a camera.
The best thing to cover is learning to use a 2 or three light system, like this Interfit package.. What we can learn with this setup can be carried down to speedlights like you have or up to the more expensive lighting systems. What we'd focus on would be the lighting problems and the solutions, not the level of equipment.
Based on the results that we are already seeing, I want to do everything possible to not only encourage people to consider something like it for their opwn churches; but, show them how it can be done without breaking the bank. Besides, it would be a lot of fun. 
quote:
ORIGINAL: Holdcard
I think we're on the same page Biblically speaking. It's not about numbers or church membership, the goal is to introduce people to the one true God using the anointing He's given you. Can't speak for everyone, but the path God chose for me was a total surprise. People think I'm kidding or trying to be extra spiritual when I say I just show up and watch God work. It really is true in any ministry endeavor God has placed me in. My responsibility is to show up and do the bull work, then God handles the spiritual aspects. I'm always amazed.
As far as the church being committed, I'm not sure how that will work. They talk a lot, but little gets done (not a judgment, just a fact). So I will move ahead under the assumption that I will be footing the bill myself, if they help out it's just an added blessing and I will be happy about it.
I will probably sign up for the classes you mentioned, although I looked all the things you recommended up I still don't completely understand how to use them all in unison. Once I complete a few of the classes it may make a lot more sense to me. I'll try to start with the basics and work my way up with the classes, I may have some questions along the way. How do you feel about starting a new thread so we don't muddy this one up. Although this conversation is sort of on topic it really doesn't relate that well to your original post. A how to thread may help others as well.
Photography is my personal hobby, I do it for relaxation. I've found that God gives me talents for His glory, my enjoyment is just a benefit of obedience.
Thanks again for all your wisdom, it's fun watching God work isn't it !!
Hodlcard
< Message edited by TMeeks -- 1/22/2009 3:20:19 PM >
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: Using Photography for outreach - 1/22/2009 7:24:00 PM
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Holdcard
Posts: 269
Joined: 1/14/2009
From: Phoenix, Arizona
Status: offline
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You can count me in. I'd really enjoy learning, I like the fact that others can benefit from this too.
Another thing that may or may not be a great idea is photographing jewelery/valuables for insurance purposes. Others have keepsakes they want photos of. I think I'd want to limit that activity as a joint venture with a neighborhood watch so there would be plenty of law enforcement presence. Don't want to set anyone up for a robbery. Just an idea.
The more I think about it, this has all kind of possibilities and any equipment I buy will have many uses. I'm looking forward to this, I hope others will get involved. It's a great outreach and a fun hobby.
Holdcard
_____________________________
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If You Want To POPULATE Heaven
You Have To PLUNDER Hell!!
4th Man Ministries
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RE: Using Photography for outreach - 1/22/2009 11:03:09 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1427
Joined: 1/27/2007
Status: online
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Bigger Light is Softer Light
Let's start with what you have... a single external flash, the SB800.
When it comes to lighting, one of the most basic things to know is that the bigger the light source in relation to the subject, the softer it will appear to be.
It is this principle that expains why the small flash on a point and shoot camera almost invariably results in harsh shadows. The light source is tiny compared to the size of a person.
The same is true of a bare external flash, like the Nikon SB800 or a Canon 580EX. The light source is bigger than the tiny flash in a point and shoot; but, it's still very small compared to humans.
To soften the light from a flash, we need to modify it to make it seem bigger. One way to do this is to bounce it off the ceiling or off a wall. The ceiling or wall becomes the light source instead of the flash directly. Walls and ceilings are bigger than people, so the light tends to wrap around them and appear to be softer and less harsh.
There are many attachments that fit onto camera speedlights that help to scatter the light before reflecting it off the wall or ceiling. The Gary Fong Lightsphere includes a cap that simulates the ceiling for rooms where the actual ceiling is too high to be useful.
Another way to make light from a speedflash appear to be bigger is to use an umbrella to reflect or diffuse and scatter the light from the flash. This is one of the least expensive ways to soften light from a flash, be it a speedflash or a monolight. The light then acts as if it were the size of the umbrella.
A version of the umbrella that really works well to soften light is called the Softlighter. It combines a reflective umbrella with a translucent cover to more evenly distribute the bounced light.
When we say that the light 'wraps' around the subject, we mean that the light coming from the edges of the large light source are able to reach farther back around the circumference of the object from big light sources than they are from the edges of small light sources. This is because some of the light comes at the subject from the sides of the subject while small light sources can only direct light from a small center point.
Interestingly, the closer the light source is to the subject the larger and softer it becomes. Yes, it's brighter. But, that doesn't mean harsher. If you move an umbrella back far enough it begins to act like a small flash again. This is counter-intuitive to most people.
An Exercise to test the concept
Find a willing subject and point your flash at them and take a picture. Find a white card the size of a normal piece of paper. Have someone hold it behind your SB800 and point the speedlight backwards toward the paper and take another picture. The result should be at least noticebly softer and less harsh.
If you have a large piece of white foamcore or poster paper, have someone hold it at a 45 degree angle off to one side of the camera and point the SB800 at the white foamcore and take another picture. The light should be softer still since the foamcore is better than letter sized paper.
Stand about 4 feet from a white wall and have the subject stand about 6 feet away from you and 4-6 feet from the wall. Aim the SB800 at the wall about 1/3 the distance between you and the subject to see what happens. Experiment with changing the light aiming point and both your and the subject's position.
As you begin to see how you can use physical attributes of the room you are in, like the walls and ceilings to make the light source appear to be bigger, you'll get more pleasing images with just one single flash.
The mistake most people make is that we stand people up in front of a wall when in reality it may be better to stand them away from the wall and point the speedlight at the wall, not the subject. The fact that a point and shoot cannot generally or easily do this is a major reason for moving to an SLR.
Bigger light is softer light.
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: Using Photography for outreach - 1/23/2009 10:46:40 AM
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Holdcard
Posts: 269
Joined: 1/14/2009
From: Phoenix, Arizona
Status: offline
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That sounds good, you've confirmed some of the things I've stumbled on or learned by accident.
I'm going to have to work on the exercise later in the day, long story but our client was at the hospital last night. Aspirated pneumonia, it's actually kind of common with his disability. The doc is letting us treat him at home so he'll be taking the bulk of our time.
Before I start lesson 1, I already have a question. What settings are you using on the camera. Mine really doesn't have a totally automatic setting. I can do Programed, Manual, Shutter Speed, and Aperture. Most of the time I use the Shutter Speed option when photographing a room full of people, but when doing something specific I use manual. When I go from the flash straight on to reflected will I need to change settings some to make up for the lack of light. I realize that the light will be larger and softer, but doesn't that effect exposure too?
Thanks, you're a great teacher by the way. Clear and concise.
Holdcard
_____________________________
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If You Want To POPULATE Heaven
You Have To PLUNDER Hell!!
4th Man Ministries
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RE: Using Photography for outreach - 1/23/2009 4:57:03 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1427
Joined: 1/27/2007
Status: online
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My father-in-law has Parkenson's and periodically ends up with aspirated pnuemonia.
Based on what I see in the Quick Start Guide for the XS, you should have A-DEP, M, Av, Tv, P and Full Auto (the green box) shooting selections. But, if you are already using shutter or aperature priority that is all the better.
Softening the light does have SOME affect on the range. In a large room, trying to get a wide area as you often do, it is a toss-up as to what would be the most effective. I would tend NOT to try to capture wide general areas and focus on more specific subjects. But, that is a personal preference.
But, for this series I'll limit the discussion to techniques and concept leading to being able to pull off a portrait ministry. And, in that context a bare flash is pretty close to useless. When shooting portraits I like to shot in manual mode at 1/200, the maximum sync speed of the XS or XSi in order to minimize the effects of movement or camera shake. But, I DEFINITELY try not to let the camera go below 1/60th of a second.
Tonight I'll post a short mini lesson on the color of various light sources.
Had you been shooting RAW along with your JPGs?
quote:
ORIGINAL: Holdcard
That sounds good, you've confirmed some of the things I've stumbled on or learned by accident.
I'm going to have to work on the exercise later in the day, long story but our client was at the hospital last night. Aspirated pneumonia, it's actually kind of common with his disability. The doc is letting us treat him at home so he'll be taking the bulk of our time.
Before I start lesson 1, I already have a question. What settings are you using on the camera. Mine really doesn't have a totally automatic setting. I can do Programed, Manual, Shutter Speed, and Aperture. Most of the time I use the Shutter Speed option when photographing a room full of people, but when doing something specific I use manual. When I go from the flash straight on to reflected will I need to change settings some to make up for the lack of light. I realize that the light will be larger and softer, but doesn't that effect exposure too?
Thanks, you're a great teacher by the way. Clear and concise.
Holdcard
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: Using Photography for outreach - 1/23/2009 7:00:42 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1427
Joined: 1/27/2007
Status: online
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Mixing Light Sources is Bad
The phenominon that we call 'Light' is really a series of wavelengths from short to long. Some wavelengths cannot be seen by our eyes. Radiant heat is really light. But, while we can feel it, we cannot see it.
In our day-to-day lives we experience lighting that falls into 3 basic categories. Outdoor light contains the widest spectrum of wavelengths including BLUE wavelengths.
Incandescent lights put out very little blue. Their output is mostly in the yellow and red wavelenth spectrum.
Fluorescent bulbs tend to put out light in an extremely narrow spectrum. It's so narrow that it's seen as a huge spike when plotting the output on a graph. Cool fluorescent lights have a green spike. Warm fluorescent lights have two spikes, one red and the other green. Daylight balanced fluorescent lights have three spikes, one red, one green and one blue. There are many people that argue that because the ramp from one end of the color spectrum to the other is not 'continuous' then it is inferior lighting. On a theoretical basis I disagree because our eyes and all digital cameras can only capture light as three distinct values which are post-processed in our brains or camera's software. But, on a practical level, there DOES seem to be something inferior about Daylight Balanced fluorescent lighting. There is simply no 'punch' to it.
Our Eye/Brain sight system is a marvelous creation of God. If we look at a white piece of paper in an incandescently lit room it will look white. Bring it over to a window so that sunlight hits it and it will look white. Carry it into an office lit with Cool Fluorescents and it will look white.
Cameras are not so sophisticated. That same white sheet will appear to be orange under incandescent light, blue under sunlight and green under fluorescent light to your camera's sensor. To produce an image where the sheet of paper looks white, the camera's software must color correct it by raising the colors that were deficient in the original light source.
The shot taken in incandescent lighting must have the greens raised a little and the blues boosted a lot. The picture under Cool White Fluorescents must have the reds and blues raised to equal that of the natural green of that light source. The image taken in the sunlight actually needs the least amount of boosting because daylight contains nearly equal amounts of all three wavelengths. So, obviously daylight is the preferred type of light source for photos.
But, what happens when a image is taken in mixed light sources. For example, you are in a room lit from above with overhead Cool White fluorescents. The subject is sitting in a chair with an incandescent lamp to their left and a window to their right. How can you truly color correct that image? If you boost the blues to correct for the lamp, the part of the image lit by the window will take on a blue cast. If you add red and blue to correct for the green in the overhead light, the area dominated by the lamp will become even MORE orange.
It's almost impossible to reach a full compromise when lighting is mixed. And, if what you are trying to shoot is a portrait the skin tones will probably end up hideous and unnatural no matter what you do.
So, for your portrait work, use uniform light sources. If you go with continuous lighting, use ALL continuous lighting and avoid also using a bare flash or letting light fall onto your subject through a window. Set your camera to the INCANDESCENT color correction setting.
BUT, there IS a way to use your flash along with household lighting. You modify the color coming our of your flash with an attachment that filters the light output to match your room lights. There are a lot of ways to do this. But, I'll describe my two favorite tools.
Since most people that own an SLR only have one flash attachment, like the Nikon SB800 or the Canon 580EX, the most convenient way is to use an orange filter over the flash. The SB800 comes with a set of filters, which is nice. Those who don't have these filters can use something like an orange Sto-Fen filter over the light. If shooting in an office situation use a green Sto-fen to match the office lights and select the Fluorescent color correction setting on your camera.
My favorite filter for portable work is the Gary Fong Lightsphere with the Amberdome top. It's more expensive than the Sto-fen; but, also more effective.
But, when I am shooting with multiple speedlights on lightstands in big areas dominated by incandescent lighting then I prefer to bound the speedlights off of gold reflective umbrellas. In this way I can let the predominant room lighting work WITH my speedlights, not against them. Umbrellas are inexpensive and effective in these situations where you are trying to add light without mixing light values.
Exercise
Light a person's face on one side with a lamp while they are standing near a window. Take a shot of their head and shoulders and try to get natural skin tones on both side of the face.
< Message edited by TMeeks -- 1/23/2009 9:11:19 PM >
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: Using Photography for outreach - 1/26/2009 10:41:05 AM
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Holdcard
Posts: 269
Joined: 1/14/2009
From: Phoenix, Arizona
Status: offline
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Keep them coming. I'm not able to run this latest set of exercises yet. We live in an dingy old 800 sq. ft. apartment (2 adults, 1 person with a severe disability and a 140 Lb. Mastiff, yeah the place is full). I have room at food ministry in the fellowship hall of the church we meet in, but this week there were other issues to be dealt with. I'm filing, and possibly printing all this out so I can get everything out of these lessons. I learn by doing, so you're really helping me at this point.
I've experienced the mixing light problem. When I got the D300 all our ministry photos had a blue tint to them. It took me a while, but I think I have the best workaround I can, then look a lot better now. I can't really afford to outfit the whole fellowship hall with color corrected lighting 
I"m looking in the book now to see how to use the SB800 off camera, my D70 had it more or less built in and would sync the flash wireless, not sure how the D300 is set up, I haven't been able to set it up yet.
Thanks again!
Holdcard
_____________________________
---
If You Want To POPULATE Heaven
You Have To PLUNDER Hell!!
4th Man Ministries
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RE: Using Photography for outreach - 1/27/2009 10:40:48 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1427
Joined: 1/27/2007
Status: online
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You can easily figure out what is causing a color cast in your images with the following list
Orange/Yellow Cast - Room lights, Warm White Flourescents, street lamps
Blue Cast - Daylight coming into a room, flash when camera set to incandescent, Daylight Flourescent when camera set to flourescent white balance.
Green Cast - Cool White Flourescent
A flash is blue in nature, since it's set up to 5000K-5500K. So, if you get a blue cast inside it's usually because the camera was set to incandescent white balance. What you might have been seeing was actually a mix of your flash with Cool White Flourescents. The Flourescents would add a green tint that could be seen as a shade of blue.
When shooting inside, we are almost ALWAYS in a mixed lighting situation either from incandescents or flourescents. It's always a bit of a problem; but, worse when shooting a large area. So, as I said, it's sometimes easier to join the problem rather than fighting it with either a gold diffuser or a green diffuser, or colored filters.
Once you remove the flash from your camera a light from the right or the left, you will begin to see a real difference in your photos. It's nice to see that you have found a tuturial on driving your flash from the D300.
I know that you are trying to show the ministry's size and scope; but, I'd begin to focus on small groups at a table or a single person. When showing just a table, say with food items, try to use an odd number of items or groups... like a banana, an apple and a pear. Avoid even numbers of items or groups of items when possible. You will find the images more interesting and appealing.
I would now invest in a medium weight Light Stand ($29.90), an umbrella holder ($16.25) for the tripod on which you will mount the SB800 and an SL4000 Softlighter ($49.95). All are prices from Adorama. BHPhoto would have similar pricing. Ritz, online, should have the items; but, at a higher price.
Lastly, here are two great web sites that cover low-cost lighting alternatives, including Do It Yourself.
Lighting-Essentials.com
DIYPhotography.net/
The last time the Annex was opening for photography, we had an amazingly photogenic dog/boy show up. Here is the result.
quote:
ORIGINAL: Holdcard
Keep them coming. I'm not able to run this latest set of exercises yet. We live in an dingy old 800 sq. ft. apartment (2 adults, 1 person with a severe disability and a 140 Lb. Mastiff, yeah the place is full). I have room at food ministry in the fellowship hall of the church we meet in, but this week there were other issues to be dealt with. I'm filing, and possibly printing all this out so I can get everything out of these lessons. I learn by doing, so you're really helping me at this point.
I've experienced the mixing light problem. When I got the D300 all our ministry photos had a blue tint to them. It took me a while, but I think I have the best workaround I can, then look a lot better now. I can't really afford to outfit the whole fellowship hall with color corrected lighting
I"m looking in the book now to see how to use the SB800 off camera, my D70 had it more or less built in and would sync the flash wireless, not sure how the D300 is set up, I haven't been able to set it up yet.
Thanks again!
Holdcard
< Message edited by TMeeks -- 1/27/2009 10:47:32 PM >
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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