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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 5/9/2008 4:57:21 PM
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Sideways
Posts: 2316
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Mrs.Wifey
I have a topic... Since we talked about the Vineyard church, how do ya'll feel about such things as the "Toronto Blessing"? Do you believe that barking like a dog, or clucking like a chicken can be a true manifestation of the Holy Spirit?
I've never even heard speaking in tongues, so I don't even know what that is like. But no, I would have to say that what you're describing sounds suspicious and false to me.
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 5/9/2008 7:29:52 PM
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McGuinessMagee
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I think that when manifestations are taking over the service and there is no order that is not of God. It goes directly against his word which says that God is a God of order.
But then, I do believe there are times where God asks us to look foolish for His sake. I remember reading a story once where someone strongly felt that God had told them to go and do a handstand against the coke machine of a shop they were outside of. Out of obedience they did, not knowing that someone inside had been praying that God prove Himself to them be getting someone to do exactly that.
Having said all that I believe that speaking in tongues is very real and relevant to today. The first time I spoke in tongues I was sound asleep. I was having a dream that there was an evil presence at the end of dh's and my bed and that someone was trying to get in through our bedroom window. In my sleep I was screaming out, "In the name of Jesus, leave this house!" (three times) and then the presence left and I woke up.
Dh, who was woken up by my yelling, asked me what I was saying. When I explained to him my dream he said ,"Well, it wasn't in English."
I still don't know if anyone was actually outside trying to get in (we lived in a neighbourhood at the time where it was certainly possible), but I really would love to know, if there was someone there, if I was yelling in their native tongue. LOL
So Maggie, does that make me as kooky as you? 
Kylie 
_____________________________
They trusted in Him and defied the king's command and were willing to give up their lives rather than serve or worship any god except their own God.
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 5/9/2008 7:50:16 PM
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magdaleine
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Sure! Come join the party! That sounds like a cool experience.
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Maggie
Magdaleine's Alabaster Atrium
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 5/9/2008 8:03:07 PM
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Sideways
Posts: 2316
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quote:
ORIGINAL: McGuinessMagee
I think that when manifestations are taking over the service and there is no order that is not of God. It goes directly against his word which says that God is a God of order.
Quite right. The Bible is very clear that for tongues to be scriptural, it must be one at a time, with a speaker and an interpreter, done in an orderly fashion. I think sometimes it is possible for worship to become a sort of mass hysteria, with the emotions and energy just feeding on itself.
I've always been raised with more... constrained worship. So this sort of thing is very foreign to me. But when I see people in a massive line, one by one marching up the preacher, getting touched on the forehead and keeling over. It kinda makes me wonder if that is really the Spirit, or do the folks simply want it that bad.
I am not judging the experiences of anyone here, but with some of the more extreme cases, I find it hard not to be skeptical.
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 5/10/2008 12:21:42 AM
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nicole6598
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I have been prayed for with hands laid on but have never fallen down or anything. I remember me and my friend going down for an alter call once and us both saying "please God don't let us fall over, please don't let us fall over". I think it is mostly to do with the person more than the Spirit. I can speak in tongues (well I used to be able to) I haven't done it in a long time and when I did it was for my own private prayer and praise. I believe there are 2 types of tongues, the ones which require an interpreter and the other which is between you and God.
_____________________________
that is a dolphin at our beach
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 5/10/2008 8:46:16 AM
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Sideways
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Yes, my cousin says he prays privately in tongues, and that is between him and God. I was speaking more of communal worship.
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 5/10/2008 2:28:55 PM
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PrincessDonna
Posts: 10485
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From: Cow country, Upstate NY
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Different topic...
What do you do when an older person stops you in the store and blathers on for 20 minutes about all of the world's troubles and how the war in Iraq is to blame for all of the US' troubles right now? Where is the balance for respect for the elderly and for not allowing untruths to be spoken so lightly?
This happened to me today in Dollar General, and it started out as a pleasant conversation, but by the end, I had the urge to slap this 75 year old woman for her attitudes about soldiers and their families. I didn't slap her, BTW, just had the urge to. 
The only thing I really said to counter what she was saying was, "I don't really care what anyone thinks of the war, but to disrespect and not support soldiers and their families is just plain wrong." That's pretty much all I said because the conversation was just so uncomfortable for me and I wanted the lady to walk away. PLEASE...just walk away! 
So what would you do, and why?
_____________________________
For I will pour water on the thirsty land,
and streams on the dry ground;
I will pour out my Spirit on your offspring,
and my blessing on your descendants.
~Isaiah 44:3~
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 5/10/2008 2:46:50 PM
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solo_soprano22
Posts: 2344
Joined: 4/27/2005
From: I'm a Southern girl
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quote:
ORIGINAL: PrincessDonna
Different topic...
What do you do when an older person stops you in the store and blathers on for 20 minutes about all of the world's troubles and how the war in Iraq is to blame for all of the US' troubles right now? Where is the balance for respect for the elderly and for not allowing untruths to be spoken so lightly?
This happened to me today in Dollar General, and it started out as a pleasant conversation, but by the end, I had the urge to slap this 75 year old woman for her attitudes about soldiers and their families. I didn't slap her, BTW, just had the urge to.
The only thing I really said to counter what she was saying was, "I don't really care what anyone thinks of the war, but to disrespect and not support soldiers and their families is just plain wrong." That's pretty much all I said because the conversation was just so uncomfortable for me and I wanted the lady to walk away. PLEASE...just walk away!
So what would you do, and why?
I have to admit, I don't think this happens to me. I don't think it happens to many people I know, either.  Is it regional?
I think in unconventional ways about the war. It'd probably make most here mad; the only way I'd share what I think is if a person asks me directly about it, but even then I do it politely. No one has to agree with me, but it seems like people get up in arms when you dare to disagree with them. It's just not worth it in the grand scheme of things. I'd just tell the person what I think and get on my way.
_____________________________
For God, For Learning, Forever.
"Sometimes I Wonder Why" (Blog entry)
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 5/10/2008 3:12:38 PM
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Sideways
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I've known plenty of folks who are enraged by our administration's handling of the middle east, but I've never known a single soul who spoke out against the soldiers and their families.
I do however, know lots and lots of people who think that not liking our foreign policy means that we hate the US soldiers.
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 5/10/2008 3:44:51 PM
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Mrs.Wifey
Posts: 4904
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From: The Gorgeous plains of Colorado
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quote:
ORIGINAL: PrincessDonna
Different topic...
What do you do when an older person stops you in the store and blathers on for 20 minutes about all of the world's troubles and how the war in Iraq is to blame for all of the US' troubles right now? Where is the balance for respect for the elderly and for not allowing untruths to be spoken so lightly?
This happened to me today in Dollar General, and it started out as a pleasant conversation, but by the end, I had the urge to slap this 75 year old woman for her attitudes about soldiers and their families. I didn't slap her, BTW, just had the urge to.
The only thing I really said to counter what she was saying was, "I don't really care what anyone thinks of the war, but to disrespect and not support soldiers and their families is just plain wrong." That's pretty much all I said because the conversation was just so uncomfortable for me and I wanted the lady to walk away. PLEASE...just walk away!
So what would you do, and why?
I would have simply said, "really, my husband is a Marine" and walked away.
quote:
but I've never known a single soul who spoke out against the soldiers and their families.
I had a woman start going off on me in Walmart when Micah was deployed, her topic of choice was how awful it was that so many men(soldiers, Marines, etc...) were support such an awful war and that if they would just stop being such *insert choice words* that the war would be over.
Yeah... It took every ounce of self control in my body to not run over her toes with my cart that had a 20lbs bag of flour and several large bags of sugar that I was purchasing to make cookies for Micah's entire unit.
_____________________________
Ryanne Gabriella Alexis born 8-22-07!
The opinions stated in the above post are solely mine and in no way should they be
construed as offensive due to your own insecurity.
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 5/10/2008 3:51:40 PM
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Sideways
Posts: 2316
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Mrs.Wifey
I had a woman start going off on me in Walmart when Micah was deployed, her topic of choice was how awful it was that so many men(soldiers, Marines, etc...) were support such an awful war and that if they would just stop being such *insert choice words* that the war would be over.
Yeah... It took every ounce of self control in my body to not run over her toes with my cart that had a 20lbs bag of flour and several large bags of sugar that I was purchasing to make cookies for Micah's entire unit.
I would've run her over.
Like I said, I've never actually experienced it myself, just lots of conservatives who think that being a good American means always agreeing with Bush, and never speaking a word of disagreement on national policy.
My family is heavily military. My brother has been to Iraq and will likely to return. I can pray for him, send him care packages and send all my love and best wishes along with him ... and still not like how the big picture has been handled.
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 5/10/2008 3:53:57 PM
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PrincessDonna
Posts: 10485
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Cow country, Upstate NY
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quote:
I would have simply said, "really, my husband is a Marine" and walked away.
But that would be lying (for me anyway).
Tamara, I'm not sure it's a regional thing. Do you mean the anti-war stuff or the little old ladies stopping you in the store? In general, this area is very pro-soldier, if not pro-war (you can be one and not the other). The specific town that store is in is a more liberal anti-war town, I think due to having a large liberal university there.
I'm also not sure this lady wasn't just desperate for conversation, or maybe even senile. Since I didn't have my beautiful children with me to comment on like normal little old ladies do...she started in on gas prices and went downhill from there. 
_____________________________
For I will pour water on the thirsty land,
and streams on the dry ground;
I will pour out my Spirit on your offspring,
and my blessing on your descendants.
~Isaiah 44:3~
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 5/10/2008 4:04:22 PM
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Mrs.Wifey
Posts: 4904
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From: The Gorgeous plains of Colorado
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quote:
But that would be lying (for me anyway).
Well, you could have said "what do you think about Obama?". Seeing as your 1) in the North and 2) she was elderly, I'm sure she would have had an opinion about that one too 
_____________________________
Ryanne Gabriella Alexis born 8-22-07!
The opinions stated in the above post are solely mine and in no way should they be
construed as offensive due to your own insecurity.
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 5/10/2008 4:18:51 PM
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Sideways
Posts: 2316
Joined: 4/12/2005
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Mmm, I smell a lonely old woman, desperate for conversation. In this particular case, I'd say the high road would be to let the lady talk, respectfully state your opinion and be on your way. So, you did the right thing.
Our soldiers are tougher then the rantings of this lady.
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 5/10/2008 10:27:42 PM
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RepentanceIsRequired
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From: Home is where the heart is.
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DebbieLynne -- I just read/looked at some of your blog. Your "paintings" are amazing!! I LOVE EM'!!
_____________________________
--Nicole--
"Icons, incense, chant...smells and bells...served up with tested sound theology, proven faith and a generous portion of beauty...that's home cooking to a hungry soul." -- unworthyseraphim
Mary Christine born 4-4-08
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 5/11/2008 5:34:44 PM
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bride48
Posts: 4632
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From: Near Boston
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Glad you visited and liked my work. I really enjoy my digital art, so I'm pleased that you liked it too!
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Joyfully,
DebbieLynne
See my thoughts on "America The Beautiful" at Joyfully Christian Lady's Museum
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 5/12/2008 9:05:55 PM
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TwinCityGirl
Posts: 876
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quote:
ORIGINAL: PrincessDonna
What do you do when an older person stops you in the store and blathers on for 20 minutes about all of the world's troubles and how the war in Iraq is to blame for all of the US' troubles right now? Where is the balance for respect for the elderly and for not allowing untruths to be spoken so lightly?
I am a master at changing the subject. Since I didn't know the woman, I would probably have said something non-committal like "Well, the world is very diverse, isn't it?" and then changed the subject or something. It's not that I *wouldn't* discuss the state of the world or the war with a stranger but if I weren't up for it I wouldn't. Or if I was in complete disagreement with her viewpoint I just wouldn't bother. It's not the time or place for lively debate.
But I know what you mean -- I know how it feels to be kind of trapped by someone verbally and not want to feel rude by breaking free.
Jeanie
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Hezbollah needs to be {something that would violate TOS} and the government is made up of a bunch of incompetent fools. But what's new? I'm just waiting for the people to get fed up, vote all those morons out of office and vote in people who DON'T have blood on their hands. Fat chance...they're just too complacent and too used to "how things are". On the bright side though, maybe we'll head to Greece!