RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (Full Version)

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green0416 -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/27/2008 4:03:14 PM)

I don't really agree with not vaccinating. My children are vaccinated. I'm not worried about them getting sick for the most part. I've done what I can to protect them and still let them be kids . But the only reason people can choose not to vaccinate their children is because almost everyone else does. People used to be desparate for vaccines (polio anyone?). I guess you have to research, weigh the risks and make your own decision. Viruses are constantly changing no matter what you're inoculated against. And God is in control. He'll do what He desires, and it will be for our good, even if we don't like it.



2shaye -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/27/2008 4:28:37 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: solo_soprano22
I'm only asking if "vaccinating" parents ever give thought to this "risk" from others who aren't vaccinated-- whether it's big or small in their minds (or non-existent).

Yes, I give it some thought. I feel it's a small risk.

I also don't think the public school is allowed to make known who is vaxed and who isn't.



TammyIsBlessed -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/27/2008 5:04:51 PM)

Delayed vaxers - do your kids end up hating going to the doctor because they get old enough to remember the shots and they get shots pretty much every time they go to the dr?



Sideways -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/27/2008 5:10:35 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: green0416
But the only reason people can choose not to vaccinate their children is because almost everyone else does.


Indeed, the only reason it is so unlikely that children will get deadly diseases, is that the overwhelming multitudes have made the decision easier for the non-vaxers. By millions of parents choosing to "risk" vaccination, the non-vaxers can afford to not risk their child.

That being said, my cousin's baby had seizures after he had the whooping cough vaccine. I totally understand why she refused all further whooping cough boosters, and delayed the rest. But it would've been overkill if she refused all vaccinations.



solo_soprano22 -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/27/2008 5:27:43 PM)

quote:

Indeed, the only reason it is so unlikely that children will get deadly diseases, is that the overwhelming multitudes have made the decision easier for the non-vaxers. By millions of parents choosing to "risk" vaccination, the non-vaxers can afford to not risk their child.


Indeed. I was reading a NY Times article yesterday for bioethics (I chose this article), and a doctor quoted there actually referred to that as the Achilles' Heel of vaccinations now. But he's coming from the viewpoint that he thinks people are choosing not to vaccinate for wrong reasons many times today.



Sunnymom -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/27/2008 5:28:46 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: TammyIsBlessed

Delayed vaxers - do your kids end up hating going to the doctor because they get old enough to remember the shots and they get shots pretty much every time they go to the dr?

When you delay, kids become old enough to understand what is going on, rather than when they are itty-bitty and don't know why the doctor or nurse is causing them pain. Mine don't like getting shots, but they don't carry on about it either.



lexie -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/27/2008 6:12:00 PM)

quote:

Delayed vaxers - do your kids end up hating going to the doctor because they get old enough to remember the shots and they get shots pretty much every time they go to the dr?


I imagine it's just the same as when you are older and getting the booster shots, you remember what it is like and you know how it's going to be. Most children start to remember what it's like around 18 months anyway while there are still a lot of vaccines, plus the schedule put out by whoever (here it's gov't) has them getting shots every few years anyway.



peculiar_lady2 -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/27/2008 7:37:10 PM)

quote:

But the only reason people can choose not to vaccinate their children is because almost everyone else does.

actually WHEN we chose to not vax our kids we knew NO ONE IRL that chose to not vax their kids. Since then I have met two that choose that (one is a biology and chemistry teacher and just doesn't trust all those chemicals...no medical reason; the other is medical reasons).



Mrs.Wifey -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/27/2008 8:31:19 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: peculiar_lady2

quote:

But the only reason people can choose not to vaccinate their children is because almost everyone else does.

actually WHEN we chose to not vax our kids we knew NO ONE IRL that chose to not vax their kids. Since then I have met two that choose that (one is a biology and chemistry teacher and just doesn't trust all those chemicals...no medical reason; the other is medical reasons).


Same here. I'm the only person I know IRL who even delays/selectively vax's.



Jenny-Fair -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/27/2008 8:35:46 PM)

I think the quote meant because almost everyone else does VACCINATE, lol. Not that almost everyone else chooses not to.



Mrs.Wifey -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/27/2008 8:39:50 PM)

Oh, I know what the quote meant.



Sideways -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/27/2008 8:47:04 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mrs.Wifey

quote:

ORIGINAL: peculiar_lady2

quote:

But the only reason people can choose not to vaccinate their children is because almost everyone else does.

actually WHEN we chose to not vax our kids we knew NO ONE IRL that chose to not vax their kids. Since then I have met two that choose that (one is a biology and chemistry teacher and just doesn't trust all those chemicals...no medical reason; the other is medical reasons).


Same here. I'm the only person I know IRL who even delays/selectively vax's.


So, you're basically banking on the fact that everyone else will vaccinate to protect your child. Some folks have good reason to refuse, like when my cousin's baby reacted to the whopping cough vaccine.



Mrs.Wifey -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/27/2008 9:04:19 PM)

Well the vax's we have skipped are not fatal diseases. Our choices for delaying/skipping are based on medical reasons that have been backed up by our pediatrician and my own research. Her exemption form is marked "medical", not "philosophical".

I'm certainly not doing it just to be "crunchy".



2shaye -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/27/2008 10:33:28 PM)

I know quite a few families who have chosen to never vax.



Sunnymom -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/27/2008 10:52:53 PM)

Take the Hep B virus- those at risk are -
quote:


* Sexually active heterosexual adults with more than one sex partner in the prior 6 months, or have a history of sexually transmitted disease;
* Homosexual and bisexual men;
* Illicit injection drug users;
* Persons at occupational risk of infection;
* Hemodialysis patients;
* Household and sex contacts of persons with chronic HBV infection;
* Clients and staff of institutions for the developmentally disabled.

It is transmitted through blood, unprotected sex, shared or re-used needles, and from an infected mother to her newborn baby during delivery.


So not every single immunization is a necessary one. I understand polio, DTaP, MMR, etc... but not giving an infant who is not at risk a shot when they are 8 hours old- which is when my ped gave my son a shot WITHOUT MY PERMISSION- May the fleas of a thousand camels nest in his armpits and reproduce abundantly.[:@]



peculiar_lady2 -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/27/2008 11:12:26 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sideways

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mrs.Wifey

quote:

ORIGINAL: peculiar_lady2

quote:

But the only reason people can choose not to vaccinate their children is because almost everyone else does.

actually WHEN we chose to not vax our kids we knew NO ONE IRL that chose to not vax their kids. Since then I have met two that choose that (one is a biology and chemistry teacher and just doesn't trust all those chemicals...no medical reason; the other is medical reasons).


Same here. I'm the only person I know IRL who even delays/selectively vax's.


So, you're basically banking on the fact that everyone else will vaccinate to protect your child. Some folks have good reason to refuse, like when my cousin's baby reacted to the whopping cough vaccine.

yeah I guess my personal reason isn't totally backed up by medical science right now (though they are finally starting to see the connection) so I don't have a real reason to not vax. Oh well...it's still our choice, and I really don't care what everyone else chooses for themselves. I just don't want people thinking they have the right to choose for ME what MY kids need or don't need.



Auben -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/28/2008 4:45:40 PM)

No, it doesn't worry me. I don't see life as something that can be controlled in every facet. In my mind the chance of my vaccinated child getting sickness from a non-vaccinated child is much slighter than my child getting into a car accident. I see more danger in allowing the government to comfortably make that decision for every person. I've seen too many special circumstances.

We selectively/delayed vaccinations for most of our children. We chose to skip the chicken pox and the new (at the time) pneumococcal vax. Our pediatrician was OK with both of those. The rest were given after 6 months. My children had all their shots before 3 and none really remember it.


With respect to the pro-vax point of view (I think vaccinations are a wonderful blessing to our society), people would make the decision not to vax whether 90% of society was vaccinated or not. They aren't making the decision because you are making them safe. They are making the decision because they think it is the right thing to do. Perhaps the proliferation of measles or mumps would change their mind, but I truly think many of them would weather it the way their great grandparents weathered it....as something from life that you can't control. Its a different viewpoint and I doubt huffing about how you are making their child safe is going to change their opinion. It just makes the complainer look silly.



solo_soprano22 -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/28/2008 6:25:03 PM)

People aren't saying that those who choose not to vaccinate do so because the majority chooses to. [&:] (That's not what doctors mean by it anyway, unless they're just bent on everyone vaccinating despite medical reasons, etc.-- I know there are docs like that). I assume if 10% decided to get vaccinated, at least the ones who can't get vaccinated for medical reasons still would not. The diseases probably wouldn't be under control anyway however.



peculiar_lady2 -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/28/2008 6:54:58 PM)

quote:

People aren't saying that those who choose not to vaccinate do so because the majority chooses to.

the person said exactly that.....their statement was....
quote:

But the only reason people can choose not to vaccinate their children is because almost everyone else does.

that is generalizing and has nothing to do with why we chose to not vax.



Sideways -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/28/2008 8:08:03 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: peculiar_lady2

quote:

People aren't saying that those who choose not to vaccinate do so because the majority chooses to.

the person said exactly that.....their statement was....
quote:

But the only reason people can choose not to vaccinate their children is because almost everyone else does.

that is generalizing and has nothing to do with why we chose to not vax.


Not exactly. What that statement means is that the only reason you are able to safely choose to not vax your kids is because so many others do vax.

If the vast majority of parents did not vax, you would be facing a much different decision regarding vaccinations, with much higher consequences for not vaxing.

It does not speak to your reasons why...



solo_soprano22 -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/28/2008 8:24:24 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: peculiar_lady2

quote:

People aren't saying that those who choose not to vaccinate do so because the majority chooses to.

the person said exactly that.....their statement was....


I was just trying to clarify what it's supposed to mean-- people seem mistaken. It doesn't involve why someone did or did not vaccinate-- whether it's a legit reason or not. Reasons are left out.



peculiar_lady2 -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/28/2008 10:55:57 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sideways

quote:

ORIGINAL: peculiar_lady2

quote:

People aren't saying that those who choose not to vaccinate do so because the majority chooses to.

the person said exactly that.....their statement was....
quote:

But the only reason people can choose not to vaccinate their children is because almost everyone else does.

that is generalizing and has nothing to do with why we chose to not vax.


Not exactly. What that statement means is that the only reason you are able to safely choose to not vax your kids is because so many others do vax.

If the vast majority of parents did not vax, you would be facing a much different decision regarding vaccinations, with much higher consequences for not vaxing.

It does not speak to your reasons why...

actually no...the reason we are able to is because the LAW still says we can are perfectly capable of choosing not to if we want to!!!

Solo...I understand what you are saying about dr's.....but that's not what that poster said....I quoted what they said and it is NOT what dr's say. If that's what they meant then they said it wrong.



Sideways -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/29/2008 9:41:09 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: peculiar_lady2
actually no...the reason we are able to is because the LAW still says we can are perfectly capable of choosing not to if we want to!!!


Legally yes. But you're missing the main point.

The reason it is safe for you to choose not to vaccinate is because most other parents have. If it were a choice between possibly triggering autism or almost certainly getting something nasty like polio, the decision would be much more difficult.



peculiar_lady2 -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/29/2008 10:24:02 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sideways

quote:

ORIGINAL: peculiar_lady2
actually no...the reason we are able to is because the LAW still says we can are perfectly capable of choosing not to if we want to!!!


Legally yes. But you're missing the main point.

The reason it is safe for you to choose not to vaccinate is because most other parents have. If it were a choice between possibly triggering autism or almost certainly getting something nasty like polio, the decision would be much more difficult.

no...you're not getting it. I don't fit into a little box...and no matter how many times you try to put me and our decision into it, that's not how it is. The reason it is safest for us to not vax is because of medical reasons that make my kids at higher risk for averse reactions to those things in vax's...it has nothing to do with whether someone else does or doesn't...MY kids are at higher risk WITH the vax then without it...medically speaking.



stampinlady -> RE: Vaccinated children and risk from others (3/29/2008 1:27:48 PM)

quote:

The reason it is safe for you to choose not to vaccinate is because most other parents have


This is an interesting point. If Polio was still prevelant would you still wait to vax?



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