RE: Be Holy? (Full Version)

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URForgiven -> RE: Be Holy? (5/4/2008 1:09:46 PM)

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ORIGINAL: rcjames

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ORIGINAL: URForgiven

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ORIGINAL: rcjames

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ORIGINAL: Dennis2
What matters in a Christians life are those things that the Holy One accomplishes through them as they depend on the One who is Holy...Jesus Christ.



I am saying the the Christian has the free will to choose to sin or not sin, and they had best be choosing to not sin.



RC, the choice is not to sin or not to sin. The choice is to depend upon Jesus Christ or not.

It was God's will to give man free will, so that we would use that free will to choose His will.

When we are depending on Jesus, we will not sin. When we are depending on ourselves, we have no choice but to sin.

Peace


When a person decides to not follow Christ and chooses instead to follow ourselves (the flesh), what, in your opinion, does that do to our relationship with Christ?

Thanks
RC


We "follow" Christ to the cross. He then "leads" us from there. I care little for opinions, including my own. However, God apparently has something to say about how He deals with those who are His own.

"For I am convinced that neither death nor life, neither angels nor demons, neither the present nor the future, nor any powers, neither height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord." Romans 8:38,39

Now that is good news indeed. Thank you Jesus.

Peace



rcjames -> RE: Be Holy? (5/4/2008 3:31:23 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: GraceBro

Christians do sin. But, we are seen as sinless in God's eyes because of Christ's finished work on the Cross. We will never see a total end to sin in our lives until we die. But, as we learn to trust God, and believe all we have been given from Him we will see a diminishing of the sin in our life. That is all I am saying. I don't want to get into the whole "license to sin" argument because that is not what I am saying. We are holy and blameless in God's eyes because of Christ's work on our behalf. And He is faithful, not us. That is the good news of the Gospel. We have to see ourselves from God's vantage point in order to understand our position.


It would seem the whole "license to sin" thingy is hard to avoid with your suppposed opinion.

If a person who has not accepted Christ has sex with someone other than his wife; that is sin, correct.

But now you are saying that a person who is saved can have sex with someone not his wife and it is not sin? If that is what you are saying then you are advocating liscnese to sin.

I sorta figure that sin is sin, and adultery is adultery, how is the world do you take Scripture and make it not a sin; which of course is an abomination to god?

Please explain it to us less enlightened folks.

Thanks
RC



rcjames -> RE: Be Holy? (5/4/2008 3:34:24 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: URForgiven
We "follow" Christ to the cross. He then "leads" us from there. I care little for opinions, including my own. However, God apparently has something to say about how He deals with those who are His own.

"For I am convinced that neither death nor life, neither angels nor demons, neither the present nor the future, nor any powers, neither height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord." Romans 8:38,39


Well you may not give a hoot in a holler about what people think, but we are all told to make diciples (teach the truth) and you are teaching that sin in the life of a Chrisstian does not matter; just carry on and party all the way to heaven.

Please explain that ideology to us (not I did not call it theology, for I thinks God has nothing to do with the "Go for sin attitude").

Thsnks
RC



GraceBro -> RE: Be Holy? (5/4/2008 3:44:35 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rcjames
But now you are saying that a person who is saved can have sex with someone not his wife and it is not sin? If that is what you are saying then you are advocating liscnese to sin.


RC, are you reading what I have written? Where on earth did I say adultery wasn't sin? Or sin wasn't sin? And, where did I say you were "unenlightened"? C'mon man! Why can't we have a dialogue? You come across like everybody you disagree with has to convince you for something to be biblical.

Please answer me one question:

What are you doing, have you done, to obtain your holiness?

Grace and Peace



rcjames -> RE: Be Holy? (5/4/2008 4:24:55 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: GraceBro
RC, are you reading what I have written? Where on earth did I say adultery wasn't sin? Or sin wasn't sin? And, where did I say you were "unenlightened"? C'mon man! Why can't we have a dialogue? You come across like everybody you disagree with has to convince you for something to be biblical.


Well you stated that;
quote:

Christians do sin. But, we are seen as sinless in God's eyes because of Christ's finished work on the Cross.


So that sounds to me as though you say Christians can do the same thing that non-Christians do that is called sin, but it is not sin for Christians. Adultery is sin for non-Christian, but according to you not for Christians.
quote:



Please answer me one question:
What are you doing, have you done, to obtain your holiness?


I became a Christian through faith in Jesus Christ and the forgiveness of my prior sins. Then through the renewing of my mind by the Grace of God, the Sacrifice of Christ, the MInistry of the Holy Spirit, and faith in the promises of God; I learned to "Just say no" (1 Cor 10:13). If I do sin, and that is IF, not when I confess my sin, repent of that sin, and accept the frogiveness for that sin.

Now per chance I would bow uo and wilfully sin after having the knowledge of the truth (renewed mind) I would confess, repent, but fully understand taht that willful sin will be judged as Scripture plainly says;

(Heb 10:26) For there is no longer any sacrifice that will take away sins if we purposely go on sinning after the truth has been made known to us.

(Heb 10:27) Instead, all that is left is to wait in fear for the coming Judgment and the fierce fire which will destroy those who oppose God!

Now that is judgemnt, not necessary condemnation as condemnation is only one possible part of judgment. Thie judgemnt takes place during the judgemnt that we must all stand before;

(2Co 5:10) For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

See the bad part that we must all answer for?

You see the difference we have is I believe that we are responsible for disobedence to God and damage or destroy our relationship with Him by that dispbedence;

(Luk 6:46) And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?

And sir, you seem to think it matters not squat whether we live in sin or not in regards to our relationship- with God.

Go figure.

Thanks
RC



drmark -> RE: Be Holy? (5/4/2008 4:48:57 PM)

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One can sin on a daily basis, and one doesn't know if one's is 'saved' until Judgment Day.
That's not what my Bible says in 1 John 3:6-10. Do you have that passage in your Bible, CropDuster?

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Paul devised the theological concept of God as courtroom judge who can issue lasting decrees, including a permanent writ of salvation.
Where in the Pauline epistles is salvation referred to as a permanent judicial writ?

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The Church sought to pre-empt the rise of 'saved-by-faith-alone' extremism by including the Book of James in the New Testament.
What are you talking about, CD? The canon of Scripture was settled more than a thousand years before Protestant disagreement over sola fide broke out!



CropDuster -> RE: Be Holy? (5/4/2008 5:11:42 PM)

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ORIGINAL: drmark

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One can sin on a daily basis, and one doesn't know if one's is 'saved' until Judgment Day.
That's not what my Bible says in 1 John 3:6-10. Do you have that passage in your Bible, CropDuster?

quote:

Paul devised the theological concept of God as courtroom judge who can issue lasting decrees, including a permanent writ of salvation.
Where in the Pauline epistles is salvation referred to as a permanent judicial writ?

quote:

The Church sought to pre-empt the rise of 'saved-by-faith-alone' extremism by including the Book of James in the New Testament.
What are you talking about, CD? The canon of Scripture was settled more than a thousand years before Protestant disagreement over sola fide broke out!


My Bible has this thing in it called The Book of James. Yours probably does, too. I suggest you read it.



drmark -> RE: Be Holy? (5/4/2008 5:17:36 PM)

So that's your answer?? There is no reference to sinning every day in James, Paul did not write James, and reading the Book of James tells me nothing about why the Early Church included it in Scriptural canon. Did you understand any of my questions?



CropDuster -> RE: Be Holy? (5/4/2008 5:20:11 PM)

"What are you talking about, CD? The canon of Scripture was settled more than a thousand years before Protestant disagreement over sola fide broke out!"

AD 517? Wha.............? AD 517. Lemme see.......if you're not referring to an important CATHOLIC CHURCH council, then I can't imagine what you're talking about. I'm referring to the CATHOLIC CHURCH's long, editorial process, beginning around AD 150, with the redactive work of Papias of Hieropolis, continuing up to around AD 328, to collect important texts for the purpose of combining them into the official canon of the New Testament. The CATHOLIC CHURCH therein established a criteria, matched all reviewed texts against it, and then discarded those that didn't measure up. Part of that criteria was the selection of works that emphasized salvation by works, over-against Paul's emphasis on salvation by faith, to balance out the canon. Luther himself hated the Book of James, even though he taught sole authority of scripture alone. Luther was a Paulist, in the Augustinian tradition. He also contradicted himself massively.



CropDuster -> RE: Be Holy? (5/4/2008 5:25:28 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: CropDuster

quote:

ORIGINAL: drmark

quote:

One can sin on a daily basis, and one doesn't know if one's is 'saved' until Judgment Day.
That's not what my Bible says in 1 John 3:6-10. Do you have that passage in your Bible, CropDuster?

quote:

Paul devised the theological concept of God as courtroom judge who can issue lasting decrees, including a permanent writ of salvation.
Where in the Pauline epistles is salvation referred to as a permanent judicial writ?

quote:

The Church sought to pre-empt the rise of 'saved-by-faith-alone' extremism by including the Book of James in the New Testament.
What are you talking about, CD? The canon of Scripture was settled more than a thousand years before Protestant disagreement over sola fide broke out!


My Bible has this thing in it called The Book of James. Yours probably does, too. I suggest you read it.


Sorry. Read the wrong post. No......the concept of the Last Judgment is scattered all throughout the Bible. It's a basic Judeo-Christian concept. We will be judged based on how we live our lives. That's part of the essence of ethical monotheism. If we lead sinful lives, we can expect to be condemned to Hell. If not, we might be saved by God, and alllowed to go to Heaven. Either way, we can't know until the Last Judgment. If we could know in this life, then the very idea and purpose of ethical monotheism would be negated, and God's power taken away from Him. If I knew I was going to Heaven, I might completely 'blow off' God, His law and become a rotten son-of-a-gun. I'm surprised you've never heard of The Last Judgment. Give me some time. I'll look up some passages for you.



deliveredarling -> RE: Be Holy? (5/4/2008 5:55:28 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Papa-san
true alkie he cannot drink ever again... My brain sends me the same signals telling me it needs alcohol that your brain sends telling you that you need air... Once you have overcome your need, come talk to me. The brain signals and chemicals are IDENTICAL. By definition, if I had any control in the matter, I wouldn't be an alcoholic.


I am a recovered alcoholic without any need or desire for alcohol. It's called complete surrender and deliverance. I gave it to Him and He removed. Your response indicates that you are still holding on to it.
There is a difference between an alcoholic drinking and the "normal" person drinking. Obviously, we can't do it responsibly.

This whole topic is really about accountability and responsibility. If we sin, we are responsible for our choice to do it. We are accountable for that sin to God and to anyone else we harmed in the process. Easy Christianity doesn't like this form of responsibility because , oh it might be harder than how we are living. The cost for our choice is high! there is not easy street about it. Either you want everything He has to offer you or you don't. You can't have it both ways. There is no excuse for sin. Period. It is that simple. Our choices, however are not that simple. Not sinning is the sacrifice we make for Him. It is the reason He told us to count the cost before we decided to follow Him.



deliveredarling -> RE: Be Holy? (5/4/2008 5:56:38 PM)

Colossians 1:21-23 reminds us that: 21 Once you were alienated from God and were enemies in your minds because of your evil behavior. 22 But now he has reconciled you by Christ’s physical body through death to present you holy in his sight, without blemish and free from accusation— 23 if you continue in your faith, established and firm, not moved from the hope held out in the gospel.



LI Peter 1:15-16 Peter writes: 15 But just as he who called you is holy, so be holy in all you do; 16 for it is written: “Be holy, because I am holy.”

Also, I Thessalonians 4:7 states: 7 For God did not call us to be impure, but to live a holy life. 8 Therefore, he who rejects this instruction does not reject man but God, who gives you his Holy Spirit.

Just curious if any of you boys happed to take particular notice of these key verses.

I think, yet once again, it is clear.....



GraceBro -> RE: Be Holy? (5/4/2008 6:26:39 PM)

RC,

Thanks RC. Sounds like works to me.

Sin is sin regardless of whether an unbeliever or a Christian commits it. The truth is how God views our sins.

"Then he adds: "Their sins and lawless acts I will remember no more."And where these have been forgiven, there is no longer any sacrifice for sin." Hebrews 10: 17-18

Our sins are remembered no more by God because of Christ's finished work. And this leads to your bringing up of Hebrews 10:26-27. The "knowledge of truth" being sinned against is those, like yourself, who don't believe that Christ's sacrifice was once for all, but choose to keep on offering sacrifices which are no longer acceptable to God.

The judgement seat of Christ is where Christians are appraised for what they allowed Christ to do in and through them throughout their life. This is not a time where we are punished or face some sort of condemnation for our sins. Our sins have already been dealt with for all eternity at the Cross. And that is addressed later on in the same chapter of 2 Corinthians 5:

"All this is from God, who reconciled us to himself through Christ and gave us the ministry of reconciliation: that God was reconciling the world to himself in Christ, not counting men's sins against them. And he has committed to us the message of reconciliation. We are therefore Christ's ambassadors, as though God were making his appeal through us. We implore you on Christ's behalf: Be reconciled to God. " 2 Corinthians 5:18-20

Are you reconciled to God if you believe He is still counting your sins against you? God isn't counting our sins against us. This doesn't mean that we are encouraged to sin, but that in order for God to offer us His life, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, He had to deal with the sin that caused that life to leave in the first place. It is by recognizing how terrible our sin is, that it deserves death, and that Christ took that penalty for us, that we, in turn, live in thankfulness to Him. This leads to us trusting Him with our lives and being dependent on Him. Thus we aren't going to be led into a life of sin. But, if we do sin, we know that Christ has taken away our sins from the eyes of God for all eternity.

"He will keep you strong to the end, so that you will be blameless on the day of our Lord Jesus Christ. God, who has called you into fellowship with his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, is faithful." 1 Corinthians 1:8-9

Our relationship to God has nothing to do with obeying laws and regulations. There is no law written that says if we obey it we will have a relationship with God. You don't have a relationship with God by trying to live a holy life. We are already holy in God's eyes because of our faith in Christ. And it is through that faith in Christ, His finished work on the Cross and resurrected life in us, that we have a relationship.

"Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? How can you say to your brother, 'Brother, let me take the speck out of your eye,' when you yourself fail to see the plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye." Luke 6: 41-42

I guess you don't believe judging the heart of someone is a sin or bearing false witness because you have not only falsely accused me of denying what sin is, twice, but judged my heart by saying I don't care whether we live in sin or not.

RC, I don't expect to change your mind. My goal is to help those suffering under legalism, believing that they must keep themselves holy and righteous in God's eyes, through obedience to laws they can't keep, to realize that what they hope to achieve by self-effort has already been given to them by faith in Christ.

Grace and Peace



Dennis2 -> RE: Be Holy? (5/4/2008 6:30:42 PM)

RC Holy response

ORIGINAL: Dennis2
What matters in a Christians life are those things that the Holy One accomplishes through them as they depend on the One who is Holy...Jesus Christ.


Possibly our differences are a matter of semantics.

I am saying the the Christian has the free will to choose to sin or not sin, and they had best be choosing to not sin.

(1Co 10:13) There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.

Here the Word plainly says that is is God that provides the Christian the way of escape, but the Christian has the choice to take the way of escape or to deny the Sacrifice of Christ and to sin.

If they choose to willingly sin then that is a whole different ball game;

RC we choose to sin all the time. Do you ever worry? Do you ever get angry? I know I do.
The verse in 1 Cor 10:13 should be one the Holy Spirit renews our minds when we insist on being angry with someone. He provides a way out. I agree we should not want to sin. Sinning in the light is not as much fun as sinning in the darkness.

(Heb 10:26) For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

(Heb 10:27) But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

Sin is a terrible choice for a Christian to make, and can put one at great risk in their relationship with Christ.

If one continues in sin after they think they are saved, it is most likely indicitave of not being saved at all; and that is not a good situation either;

The verses in Heb is talking to those who refuse to accept the earlier verses that say
Heb 10: 17 Then he adds: "Their sins and lawless acts I will remember no more."
18 And where these have been forgiven, there is no longer any sacrifice for sin.

If you go to any other means to try to get forgiveness then there is no hope for you. Why come to understand the finality of the cross and then continue to offer animal sacrifices or go to the confession booth, or misuse 1 john 1:9 to think you are getting back in fellowship.

(Mat 7:20) Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

(Mat 7:21) Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

(Mat 7:22) Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

(Mat 7:23) And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

So yes, to answer the OP, live a holy life, reject the opportunity to sin, do not succomb to the flesh, but follow the Holy Spirit and avoid condemnation;

Matthew verses show who is born again and who is not. False prophets or religious people can do holy looking acts but unless the acts are produced by the vine working in and through the branch it means nothing. These works will be burned up as wood hay and stubble. By the way if we say we need to always obey Jesus’ words then try out more of the Sermon on the Mount and pluck your eyes out. (Mat 5:27-29

(Rom 8:1) There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
First of all the second part of this verse was not in the oldest manuscripts. Even with that part in there I still see this as a verse that says those who are walking by faith or in the Spirit are in fact children of God and there is therefore NO condemnation.
If there is condemnation then one could never be set free from the law of sin and death (verse 2)
Because the wages of sin is death, not out of fellowship or a paddling. The consequence of the cross is eternal and that is why we have eternal life because salvation is receiving His eternal resurrected life. We could never have eternal life unless the cross took away all our sins from the time of Calvary back to Adam and forward to Eternity. We are holy because we have His life living in us. We are set apart from the world because of our identity with Him not because we act so neat.
Now that we are in Him and abide in Him then we will be bearing fruit.
Thanks
RC
Love you In Christ
Dennis



rcjames -> RE: Be Holy? (5/4/2008 7:07:02 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: GraceBro
My goal is to help those suffering under legalism, believing that they must keep themselves holy and righteous in God's eyes,.


Gracebro, I would not consider it help to tell folks that they can be in the arms of adultery, die, and expect to awaken in the arms of Jesus.

I would consider that leading the sheep astray.

Sad, but true.

Thanks
RC



gmc4Jesus -> RE: Be Holy? (5/4/2008 7:08:52 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: GraceBro

Salvation by "faith alone" is not something that is "plaguing" Christianity. It is Christianity. Religion is what is plaguing Christianity. By that I mean man's best attempt to reach up to God in self-effort. If it isn't by faith, in Jesus Christ, alone, then what is by?

"...because by one sacrifice he has made perfect forever those who are being made holy." Hebrews 10:14

"I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life." 1 John 5:13

Grace and Peace


GraceBro, We are truly saved by faith in Jesus Christ. Likewise, we are made holy by God's promise through our accepting Jesus Christ. However, we are not excused form responsibility.

We must first accept Jesus as our Lord to inherit the holiness that He imparts.
Second, we must realize that we have been made holy, sanctified by God.
Third, we must grow in that holy estate to become what we claim to be. Our actions do not earn salvation or anything, but simply show that the Holy Spirit is living in us and changing our behavior to become less sinful and more like Christ.

Faith without works (actions reflecting that faith) is dead. cf. James 2:17.

God bless you and all as we work on acting like the holy people that we are through the love of God and saving grace of Jesus Christ our Lord.



bob97 -> RE: Be Holy? (5/4/2008 7:37:02 PM)

quote:

Gracebro, I would not consider it help to tell folks that they can be in the arms of adultery, die, and expect to awaken in the arms of Jesus.


RC…just a question; are you telling me that if I belong to Christ and make a mistake such as adultery, I then die without repenting that I am lost?

Bob



GraceBro -> RE: Be Holy? (5/4/2008 8:36:01 PM)

quote:

Gracebro, I would not consider it help to tell folks that they can be in the arms of adultery, die, and expect to awaken in the arms of Jesus.

I would consider that leading the sheep astray.


So would I... That is why I didn't say it. I will give you the last word because you obviously are addressing things neither said or implied. Especially, when I have answered your questions and addressed your scriptures...

quote:

Faith without works (actions reflecting that faith) is dead. cf. James 2:17.


Faith in Jesus results in works produced by Him through us. We bear the fruit of the Spirit, we don't produce it. And our faith is expressed through love (see 1 Corinthians 13)...

"A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. By this all men will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another." John 13:34-35

Known by our love, not our works.

"Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres. Love never fails." 1 Corinthians 13: 4-8

These are fruits of the Spirit we cannot produce in the energy of our own flesh. They are not produced through obedience, but by trusting in the indwelling Holy Spirit. He has given us everything so that we will learn to trust Him and be dependent on Him. By that we will no longer look to earn by works that which we have been given by faith. Amen!

God Bless you all....

Gracebro



rcjames -> RE: Be Holy? (5/4/2008 8:38:49 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: bob97

quote:

Gracebro, I would not consider it help to tell folks that they can be in the arms of adultery, die, and expect to awaken in the arms of Jesus.


RC…just a question; are you telling me that if I belong to Christ and make a mistake such as adultery, I then die without repenting that I am lost?

Bob


No sir, but I do think that the adultery, since it was not confessed, and could well be a willful sin will come under judgement. (not necessarily condemnation, but definately part of the bad done in the body and exposed for judgment before the judgment seat of CHrist).

Thsnks
RC

edited for spelling



URForgiven -> RE: Be Holy? (5/4/2008 9:06:58 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rcjames

quote:

ORIGINAL: URForgiven
We "follow" Christ to the cross. He then "leads" us from there. I care little for opinions, including my own. However, God apparently has something to say about how He deals with those who are His own.

"For I am convinced that neither death nor life, neither angels nor demons, neither the present nor the future, nor any powers, neither height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord." Romans 8:38,39


Well you may not give a hoot in a holler about what people think, but we are all told to make diciples (teach the truth) and you are teaching that sin in the life of a Chrisstian does not matter; just carry on and party all the way to heaven.

Please explain that ideology to us (not I did not call it theology, for I thinks God has nothing to do with the "Go for sin attitude").

Thsnks
RC


RC, your constant attempts to twist what people say to fit your own idealogy is not doing your cause any good. If you cannot converse with people based on what they have actually said then you are just arguing with yourself and your own invention.

We know that you know you are right, so there is no need to be devious and underhanded.

Peace



deliveredarling -> RE: Be Holy? (5/4/2008 9:27:27 PM)

I think once again, we are debating the evidence of salvation based on the "fruit" we bear. My understanding of what RC is saying is that once salvation has occurred, we will not knowingly, willingly and continually sin, because that does nor bear the evidence of salvation but rather the old self still living. I do not hear him saying that we won't sin, but if we do, we will immediately repent and turn from it.
What I hear you guys saying is that we have an automatic forgiveness whether ask for it or not. i don't hear a license to sin. The concern hear is the dismissal of sheparding the sheep. Maybe not making clear the importance of living a holy life, not because we have to or are required to, but because we desire to please our Father and we desire to be obedient to Him. maybe I'm off the mark here, but that is what I see and I share those concerns regarding the body. In Matthew it talks about the four types of soil, (the 4 types of "Christians", maybe that will help clarify???????? Just a suggestion.



bob97 -> RE: Be Holy? (5/4/2008 11:03:46 PM)

The difference is willful sinning as opposed to a remorseful sin. Christians are capable of committing an unintentionally sin and if that sin is backed with a repenting heart I think God is quite willing to forgive. If one committed the sin with an attitude of “so what”, then he would indisputably receive judgment to fit the crime and one might question the salivation but of course there is only one who can make the judgment and that would be Christ.

Bob



URForgiven -> RE: Be Holy? (5/4/2008 11:33:31 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: bob97

The difference is willful sinning as opposed to a remorseful sin. Christians are capable of committing an unintentionally sin and if that sin is backed with a repenting heart I think God is quite willing to forgive. If one committed the sin with an attitude of “so what”, then he would indisputably receive judgment to fit the crime and one might question the salivation but of course there is only one who can make the judgment and that would be Christ.

Bob


God is quite willing to forgive? Good grief, what Bible are you all reading? He sent His Son to be tortured and die on a cross...is that willing enough for you? Do you have any concept of what it cost Jesus Christ to pay for your sins?

So if we sin nonchalantly there is then extra judgement God dishes out to us, that He didn't already place on Jesus? Oh...I see now, it's indisputable. Sorry guess I didn't see that before I disputed it.

There is no more judgement for sins, Jesus Christ took all of Gods judgement upon Himself, nailing our sins to that cross, where God the Father made Him who had no sin to be sin...for us. He took all of our sins upon Himself...all of them.



bob97 -> RE: Be Holy? (5/5/2008 12:01:37 AM)

Sorry partner we were washed clean from all our sins by the blood of Christ upon our conversion. That same blood will absolve all our future sins if those sins are not willful and if we have a repenting heart.

Do you think God is going to forgive an unashamed sin or sins if its committed thinking that we have a get out of jail free card. In fact if you do sin unashamed there is a serious question if any of your sins have been washed away at all.

Bob



URForgiven -> RE: Be Holy? (5/5/2008 12:09:38 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: bob97

Sorry partner we were washed clean from all our sins by the blood of Christ upon our conversion. That same blood will absolve all our future sins if those sins are not willful and if we have a repenting heart.

Do you think God is going to forgive an unashamed sin or sins if its committed thinking that we have a get out of jail free card. In fact if you do sin unashamed there is a serious question if any of your sins have been washed away at all.

Bob


How many of your sins were in the future when Christ shed His blood on the cross?



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