|
Users viewing this topic:
none
|
|
Login  | |
|
RE: James Dobson on Obama - 6/26/2008 9:57:41 PM
|
|
|
tafkam
Posts: 2070
Joined: 9/23/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
But isn't homosexuality a choice? If so, it would seem that Haggard knew exactly what he was doing when he consciously began a long-term relationship with a male escort.
It's a choice as much as any other sin we CHOOSE to commit....
quote:
The way some people interpret the scripture is nutty.
Well the Scripture on homosexuality is pretty blunt....either you agree with it or you don't.....
< Message edited by tafkam -- 6/26/2008 10:04:32 PM >
_____________________________
"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are, 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.' - Ronald Reagan
Tafkam
|
|
|
|
|
RE: America as a Theocracy - 6/26/2008 9:58:06 PM
|
|
|
SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5511
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: GroupW
quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
quote:
ORIGINAL: GroupW
quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
If its such a rightious thing then maybe Obama's mom should have considered the proceedure.
Thanks
RC
I hope I'm not the only one that considers this offensive. I don't think comments like this reflect well on Christians, regardless of what we believe about Mr. Obama.
What is the truth is that Obama supports the murder of unborn children... That's not up for debate, it's a fact... If a person who supports the murder of 3500 unborn children daily gets hit by a bus I for one will not be losing any sleep over it...
John
Fine, but let's not adopt the language of violence in order to fight violence. That does noone any good.
Ok.... What should we call the cold blooded mass murder of unborn children for no just cause? What does God call it?
John
|
|
|
|
|
RE: James Dobson on Obama - 6/26/2008 10:16:01 PM
|
|
|
SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5511
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: todd_t
Where is the data or source to support this number (e.g. 3500 abortions in America daily)?
http://www.abortionno.org/Resources/fastfacts.html
WORLDWIDE
Number of abortions per year: Approximately 42 Million
Number of abortions per day: Approximately 115,000
Where abortions occur:
83% of all abortions are obtained in developing countries and 17% occur in developed countries.
UNITED STATES
Number of abortions per year: 1.37 Million (1996)
Number of abortions per day: Approximately 3,700
*******************************************
http://www.nrlc.org/ABORTION/facts/abortionstats.html
48,589,993 Since 1973....
35(years)x365(days)=12,775 days... (and this taking in account all of 2008...)
48,589,993/12,775=3803.5 mudered unborn children daily...
heh... .5 Kinda ironic eh?
quote:
So the lives of American citizens who are pro-life are more important to you than those who support basic abortion rights (regardless of their political stripe)?
those who support basic abortion rights=someone who supports mass murder on scale the makes most historical evil people seem tamed...
Why should I worry about those who practice death, who gain and maintain power with it, who believe it's a right... I pray daily God will either convict their hearts or bring them down...
John
Proverbs 17:15 He that justifieth the wicked, and he that condemneth the just, even they both are abomination to the Lord.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: America as a Theocracy - 6/26/2008 10:21:37 PM
|
|
|
buckifn
Posts: 1806
Joined: 5/23/2006
Status: offline
|
Dobson has as much right to state his views as anyone else does..so I don't get what the big fuss is about...but I do have to say I have become more of a supporter since he came out with this latest stance...
The abortion issue is one of several reasons why I would never vote for Obama even if he were the last man standing.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: James Dobson on Obama - 6/26/2008 10:58:50 PM
|
|
|
todd_t
Posts: 1587
Joined: 6/21/2006
From: The North Woods
Status: offline
|
quote:
UNITED STATES
Number of abortions per year: 1.37 Million (1996)
Number of abortions per day: Approximately 3,700
I would argue that if Roe is overturned, you'll see these numbers (12 years out of date) go much higher. But then again, as these abortions would be performed underground, there would be no way to get an accurate count.
quote:
Why should I worry about those who practice death, who gain and maintain power with it, who believe it's a right... I pray daily God will either convict their hearts or bring them down...
I don't think you realize how many people in this country (typically, a 63% majority) support basic abortion rights, both Democrat and Republican alike. For example, Laura Bush and her daughters are pro-choice.
Also, what does "bring them down" mean?
|
|
|
|
|
RE: James Dobson on Obama - 6/26/2008 11:10:51 PM
|
|
|
tafkam
Posts: 2070
Joined: 9/23/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
But then again, as these abortions would be performed underground, there would be no way to get an accurate count.
Well, then let's just legalize first degree murder....better to have those poor people killed in clean safe environments (where we can keep track of it) as opposed to the "underground" scenarios where anything can happen.
The logic of the pro-death movement is an amazing thing....
quote:
I don't think you realize how many people in this country (typically, a 63% majority) support basic abortion rights, both Democrat and Republican alike. For example, Laura Bush and her daughters are pro-choice.
Much of the population of it's time supported slavery as well....did that make it right?
< Message edited by tafkam -- 6/26/2008 11:16:57 PM >
_____________________________
"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are, 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.' - Ronald Reagan
Tafkam
|
|
|
|
|
RE: James Dobson on Obama - 6/26/2008 11:27:15 PM
|
|
|
todd_t
Posts: 1587
Joined: 6/21/2006
From: The North Woods
Status: offline
|
quote:
Much of the population of it's time supported slavery as well....did that make it right?
No, it was not right.
However, the notion of a state authority dictating how women can govern their own bodies is even more repugnant (in addition to being a gross abuse of power) to me than abortion itself.
I'm all for alternatives like adoption (not to mention third-trimester abortions being extremely rare), but I guarantee you that if Roe is overturned, the voter backlash versus the conservative right will be very significant. Democrats will seize a big government majority. Plus, it will culturally divide this country more dramatically than in decades.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: James Dobson on Obama - 6/26/2008 11:34:53 PM
|
|
|
Shrommer
Posts: 98
Joined: 5/4/2005
Status: offline
|
I haven't been able to read the text of Dobson's talk, but I got to read Obama's speech tonight. From the news articles...
Dobson seems to complain that he is compared with Al Sharpton. Obama only compared them as being total opposites.
Dobson accused Obama of having distorted views on the Bible, yet Obama does not express his own views of the Bible when he talks about Leviticus and Deuteronomy and the Sermon on the Mount. Obama is talking about what people out there try to make the Bible out to say.
Dobson accuses Obama of trying to get Christians to shut up until every body can agree together on a given issue. In his speech, though, Obama wants Christians to speak out and try to connect with other people at the conscience level instead of at the appeal to authority level.
I think Dr. Dobson is getting a little less clear in his ability to follow other people's thoughts in a speech as he gets older. I don't know of many 72-year-olds who are good at processing new ideas in a fresh and open-minded way. It will be good if Obama and Dobson can have a relaxed conversation together to clear away the misunderstandings.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: James Dobson on Obama - 6/27/2008 12:28:37 AM
|
|
|
SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5511
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: todd_t
I would argue that if Roe is overturned, you'll see these numbers (12 years out of date) go much higher.
Those numbers add up given the total murdered children divided by the days since Roe vs Wade, actually it’s more per year as the total numbers show…... What line of logic would make the case for the number to increase if were against the law?
48,589,993...
quote:
But then again, as these abortions would be performed underground, there would be no way to get an accurate count.
Now there is good reason for <cough> safe and legal murdering of unborn children.... 
48,589,993
quote:
I don't think you realize how many people in this country (typically, a 63% majority) support basic abortion rights, both Democrat and Republican alike. For example, Laura Bush and her daughters are pro-choice.
You think wrong, and I really don't care how many do, since that doesn't make it right... As for them being Democrats or Republicans I don't care there either... Regardless they support murder and they will be held accountable for it... Period...
quote:
Also, what does "bring them down" mean?
Kill them... What did you think it meant? Give them a pat on the back for a job well done?
48,589,993
John
|
|
|
|
|
RE: James Dobson on Obama - 6/27/2008 12:33:52 AM
|
|
|
SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5511
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: todd_t
However, the notion of a state authority dictating how women can govern their own bodies is even more repugnant (in addition to being a gross abuse of power) to me than abortion itself.
The state charge Scott Peterson with the murder of his unborn child... You against that ruling?
quote:
I'm all for alternatives like adoption
That doesn't negate the fact you support the right for someone to murder an unborn child...
quote:
(not to mention third-trimester abortions being extremely rare)
Which means nothing...
quote:
, but I guarantee you that if Roe is overturned, the voter backlash versus the conservative right will be very significant.
I doubt anyone would try to kill me over it, I can defend myself....
quote:
Democrats will seize a big government majority.
So...
quote:
Plus, it will culturally divide this country more dramatically than in decades.
The more evil something is the harder they hold on to it...
John
|
|
|
|
|
RE: James Dobson on Obama - 6/27/2008 1:19:25 AM
|
|
|
Stephanos
Posts: 1100
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Midwestern Baptist Theological Seminary in KC MO
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: todd_t
quote:
Much of the population of it's time supported slavery as well....did that make it right?
No, it was not right.
However, the notion of a state authority dictating how women can govern their own bodies is even more repugnant (in addition to being a gross abuse of power) to me than abortion itself.
I'm all for alternatives like adoption (not to mention third-trimester abortions being extremely rare), but I guarantee you that if Roe is overturned, the voter backlash versus the conservative right will be very significant. Democrats will seize a big government majority. Plus, it will culturally divide this country more dramatically than in decades.
Attempted Suicide is illegal. Do you have a problem with that? After all it IS that persons own life. I am not talking about assisted suicide for the dead and dying. I am talking about a 100% healthy average Joe on the Street.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: America as a Theocracy - 6/27/2008 2:12:01 AM
|
|
|
tracydolls
Posts: 1839
Joined: 3/30/2008
Status: offline
|
quote:
So without a doubt you desire a known evil ruler?
No, LOL,, I want an "in the closet" evil ruler.
quote:
What does that have to do with people that actually fear God?
Which ruler/ person in an office of power looks like he/she fears God to you?
quote:
You have people in there pushing their own ungodly agenda already... No need for the above group of swines...
But how do you know the next ruler will not be a Ted Haggard really?
quote:
Of course god could mean anything...
That is so true! People are going crazy, worshipping rocks they seem to me.
quote:
Of course... All we need to do is rid the world of those pesky believers and the world will heal itself and everyone will live in peace...
I'm a Believer in the God of ABraham, Isaac and Jacob. Who sent His Only Begotten Son. Jesus Christ for a sinner like me.
I just don't believe all that you believe.
_____________________________
Rev 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
|
|
|
|
|
RE: America as a Theocracy - 6/27/2008 7:55:52 AM
|
|
|
csl7037
Posts: 1774
Joined: 3/24/2008
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: tafkam
The logic of the pro-death movement is an amazing thing....
I agree it takes a great deal of mental gymnastics to justify abortion - but the reality is that's the counter-argument that we have to contend with. Ranting and raving with emotional and moral arguments and wild-eyed fanaticism has gotten us where exactly? It's gotten us solidly in the fringe category and it's exactly WHY 60-something percent of Americans favor abortion to some extent...we've chased them with picket signs and pitchforks straight to the left.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: America as a Theocracy - 6/27/2008 9:34:31 AM
|
|
|
GroupW
Posts: 2909
Joined: 11/16/2007
From: Up in the hills of Colorado (very BIG hills...)
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: buckifn
Dobson has as much right to state his views as anyone else does..so I don't get what the big fuss is about...
Absolutely, I support his right to speak out. The issue is 1) did he actually read the speech before blasting Obama on it, or 2) if he did read it, did he just completely miss the point (I think he's smarter than that) or 3) did he intentionally distort the intent of it.
None of the options are very flattering, and I expect better from our Christian leaders. This is not the first time he's distorted the statements of others. It does Christians no favors when he does that. It's unnecessary and unproductive.
< Message edited by GroupW -- 6/27/2008 9:48:41 AM >
|
|
|
|
|
RE: America as a Theocracy - 6/27/2008 9:41:32 AM
|
|
|
GroupW
Posts: 2909
Joined: 11/16/2007
From: Up in the hills of Colorado (very BIG hills...)
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Groupw
Fine, but let's not adopt the language of violence in order to fight violence. That does noone any good.
quote:
Ok.... What should we call the cold blooded mass murder of unborn children for no just cause? What does God call it?
John
The reference was to a prior post that used violent language directed at an individual . Your post above regarding someone getting hit by a bus qualifies as well.
It reflects poorly on us, and I would like people to stop.
< Message edited by GroupW -- 6/27/2008 9:47:46 AM >
|
|
|
|
|
RE: James Dobson on Obama - 6/27/2008 10:07:29 AM
|
|
|
tafkam
Posts: 2070
Joined: 9/23/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
I'm all for alternatives like adoption (not to mention third-trimester abortions being extremely rare), but I guarantee you that if Roe is overturned, the voter backlash versus the conservative right will be very significant. Democrats will seize a big government majority.
This is not about politics, todd, it's about doing what is right, and what is right is protecting the sanctity of life at all levels of development.
Personally, I don't think politics, such as overturning Roe, is the answer. I think it's going to take this country waking up to the realization of just what a holocaust abortion has been. Kinda like some folks finally realized what a terrible thing slavery was. Even that divided the country, for a while, but we got past it.
Only when that happens, if that happens, will we see abortion go away, or at least diminished.
I'm not holding my breath.....
< Message edited by tafkam -- 6/27/2008 10:15:32 AM >
_____________________________
"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are, 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.' - Ronald Reagan
Tafkam
|
|
|
|
|
RE: James Dobson on Obama - 6/27/2008 10:35:16 AM
|
|
|
blessedinnyc
Posts: 1984
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: tafkam
Even that divided the country, for a while, but we got past it.
For the record, your sentence summarizes the bloodiest war in US history...
|
|
|
|
|
RE: James Dobson on Obama - 6/27/2008 10:40:12 AM
|
|
|
blessedinnyc
Posts: 1984
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
quote:
Also, what does "bring them down" mean?
Kill them... What did you think it meant? Give them a pat on the back for a job well done?
John
Hmmm, if God is planning on killing these people, it doesn't look like he's in much of a hurry.
I trust you're not calling for humans to help God speed things up, right?
|
|
|
|
|
RE: James Dobson on Obama - 6/27/2008 10:54:31 AM
|
|
|
tafkam
Posts: 2070
Joined: 9/23/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
For the record, your sentence summarizes the bloodiest war in US history...
620, 000 people died in the Civil War....
40, 000, 000 have died as a result of abortion....
I think the war on the unborn has been quite a bit bloodier....
_____________________________
"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are, 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.' - Ronald Reagan
Tafkam
|
|
|
|
|
RE: James Dobson on Obama - 6/27/2008 11:03:41 AM
|
|
|
davemiller7
Posts: 1060
Joined: 3/5/2008
From: NC via NY
Status: offline
|
You don't think they already have grabbed power and divided the country? Don't be naiive.
-Dave
quote:
ORIGINAL: todd_t
Democrats will seize a big government majority. Plus, it will culturally divide this country more dramatically than in decades.
_____________________________
-Dave
The Prayer of Protection
The light of God surrounds me,
The love of God enfolds me,
The power of God protects me,
The presence of God watches over me.
Wherever I am, God is.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: America as a Theocracy - 6/27/2008 11:27:15 AM
|
|
|
DougHorton
Posts: 934
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Georgia
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: buckifn
Dobson has as much right to state his views as anyone else does..so I don't get what the big fuss is about...
The big fuss is that he acts as if he speaks for the Body of Christ, a sort of non-catholic Pope. He certainly does not speak for me or the Christians that I know.
_____________________________
Doug
You may think it strange, but he never likes any assistance. When he made the world, he did not ask the angel Gabriel so much as to cool the molten matter with his wing, but he did it entirely himself. -- Spurgeon
|
|
|
|
|
RE: James Dobson on Obama - 6/27/2008 11:53:45 AM
|
|
|
blessedinnyc
Posts: 1984
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: davemiller7
You don't think they already have grabbed power and divided the country? Don't be naiive.
-Dave
quote:
ORIGINAL: todd_t
Democrats will seize a big government majority. Plus, it will culturally divide this country more dramatically than in decades.
It takes two sides to have a divide.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: James Dobson on Obama - 6/27/2008 12:02:06 PM
|
|
|
davemiller7
Posts: 1060
Joined: 3/5/2008
From: NC via NY
Status: offline
|
Exactly!!! They have grabbed power and divided the country. That wasn't so hard to understand, was it?
-Dave
quote:
ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc
quote:
ORIGINAL: davemiller7
You don't think they already have grabbed power and divided the country? Don't be naiive.
-Dave
quote:
ORIGINAL: todd_t
Democrats will seize a big government majority. Plus, it will culturally divide this country more dramatically than in decades.
It takes two sides to have a divide.
_____________________________
-Dave
The Prayer of Protection
The light of God surrounds me,
The love of God enfolds me,
The power of God protects me,
The presence of God watches over me.
Wherever I am, God is.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: James Dobson on Obama - 6/27/2008 12:23:03 PM
|
|
|
rcjames
Posts: 5693
Joined: 7/15/2005
From: Oklahoma
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: todd_t
I would argue that if Roe is overturned, you'll see these numbers (12 years out of date) go much higher. But then again, as these abortions would be performed underground, there would be no way to get an accurate count.
Ah, the ole "Coat hanger" defense.
Since the babies might be murdered anyway, then lets keep the murder legal and easy.
Nonsense.
Thanks
RC
_____________________________
Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
Read the first chapter of my latest book here;
http://www.deliveranceofsara.com
|
|
|
|
|
RE: James Dobson on Obama - 6/27/2008 12:49:11 PM
|
|
|
| |
Forum Tools
Printable Version
