RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (Full Version)

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stateofgrace -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/27/2005 8:21:04 AM)

As far as the "liver cleansing" I have a friend who is on anti-depressants who swears by it, but she has some other health issues that the cleansing supposively helps as well. I don't know how much documented research there is about it, either.

agapetos, I am so glad you caught the "cure" thing...mood stabilizers for Bipolar are like Insulin for Diabetics. They work on the symptoms and bring the body chemistry back into balance, but they are a treatment, not a cure.




womaninchrist -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/27/2005 9:53:41 AM)

I know there's not a "cure" for bipolar, but we as a community do need to be aware that there are those that sell the modern version of snake oil. There's a rather popular author that sells a system to "manage" bipolar using flash cards. There's someone where I live (the Pacific NW) that regularly advertises a "therapy cure" for bipolar (he does some odd version of counseling). And yes, I've had people tell me if I'd take the right natural lithium (or any of a host of other even odder supplements) I'd be cured. There's even a major mental health group with very anti-med teachings (stuff about medications being "poison" or "toxic" and that they're "learned helplessness") - but they do say you can treat even "major mental illnesses" (like bipolar and schizophrenia) with their system - but all you can get of their system without buying their expensive books is testimonies of how it "worked for them" (and most of those are written by people who work for the group - including the group's founder). [8|]

Somehow, I have an odd knack for finding bad mental health people and being found by pushers of odd things to at least treat mental illness. I've just learned to be vary wary when someone comes through pushing something as being a miracle treatment with no available documentation beyond a personal testimony or two.




pc-queen -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/27/2005 11:15:13 AM)

What's the point of seeing a therapist?
I ask this because I've been seeing a therapist recently and I don't know if it's worth it. I'm dealing with depression, food, stress, etc. etc. Yeah, the sessions give me someone to talk to, but I'm not sure her advice is any different than advice I've received from friends. The first time I saw her I felt great afterward. Last time I just felt sad all day. What kinds of "results" should I be looking for? How do I know if it's working or if it fits me?




agapetos -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/27/2005 12:16:00 PM)

pc-queen ~ you may feel worse before you feel better with therapy. Remember it's dealing with emotions ~ some of which may be old and very painful or just ones the you may want to feel are better buried.

It depends what kind of therapy you're having ~ there is a lot out there. Speak to your therapist about where you're going with the therapy and what benefits it will bring to you. Also how long it will be before you see some results (sometimes difficult to answer) or know that what she's offering will work for you. Perhaps even set up a date for a review.

You may also find that other people see changes before you do.




salos -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/27/2005 2:09:26 PM)

Demolitionman, thanks. There are no easy answers to some of these challenges!

Here are some things that have helped me:

Using my mind. Even five minutes reading a challenging book, working a crossword, or doing math problems helps my mind be more orderly and clear.

Forgiveness, not wanting to get even.

Not allowing myself to get really overweight.

Staying away from alcohol, drugs, etc.

Memorizing bible verses.

Good friends who care about me.

My wonderful children.

My patient husband.

Finally finding a safe church.




stateofgrace -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/27/2005 6:54:27 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: womaninchrist

Somehow, I have an odd knack for finding bad mental health people and being found by pushers of odd things to at least treat mental illness.


Yep. Me too. Some of the worst stuff I heard was right when we were zeroing in on the Bipolar diagnosis for my older daughter...from a mom of a Bipolar child, and a Christian to boot. She had been put through the worst junk, mainly coming from other Christians.

Examples:

  • It was all her fault, due to some sin in her life
  • It was all because did not effectively discipline her child
  • It was due to a generational curse
  • Her daughter was posessed by demons




Hischild1994 -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (11/9/2005 9:34:02 PM)

pcqueen asked why see a therapist?

I see a therapist because he helps me to deal with issues of my past. I've had a lot of issues that make me angry or hurt me. I've always had to repress those feelings. It's very hard for me to talk to others about these feelings and the things that have happened. My therapist helps me to express the emotions that I was never allowed to express before, but needed to.

I am bi-polar and I have panic attacks. I take Wellbutrin XL, Effexor XR and when I feel a panic attack coming on I take Klonopin.




stateofgrace -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (11/10/2005 8:57:14 AM)

I can think of a couple of areas where therapists are uniquely qualified to deal with mental health related problems.

The first is in aiding parents with raising a child that has mental health problems. Therapists are trained and educated on aspects of discipline and family structure that have tended to be effective in these situations. A biblical counselor can offer the theoretical side of what needs to be done in general in the family "train up a child..." for example, but isn't usually equipped to help a parent through how to specifically apply those principles with a child who has ADD, or Bipolar disorder (as two examples).

The second is in the area of Cognitave Behavioral Therapy. Again, this can be used to apply a biblical prinicple...putting on the armor of God, the mind of Christ, etc. It's about helping people get rid of the connections between difficult situations and our reaction to them...and change destructive thinking patterns. Again, the therapist has the "how to" applicaiton specifics that work for someone with mental health conditions...the biblical counselor has the principle but is not usually trained in the specifics that will work for these individuals.




SmileyTish -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (11/10/2005 4:30:43 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Julia55

The only great studies i have is my own life experiences.Many studies have been exausted in the mental health field and by no means do they have all the answers. I know adults who have add and I had it myself and sugar consumption certainly affected my concentration span and focusing ability. I have also had bipolar and food has also affected some of my highs and lows. So I have no links for you stateofgrace but I do have a lifetime experience and I do have a perception and I perceive that for me the only medication that has ever worked for me is the Grace of god and His goodness. The more His light shines on me the more i get healed,I'm not that big on keeping up with the reaserch about mental health because it always changes and they are all learning too just like me. What we need is more people of faith and more miracles!


Does your life experiences include bi-polar in any way shape or form... Sorry, but it seems as though your definition of miracles and faith differ from mine...God allows those medications to work so that people like my husband can function in society...He has tried the come off of medication to force God to do the healing because I don't like the indirect way that he is doing now method, and I was almost killed because of it...I'm not going back that way again without a magor sign from God... I'll tell you that sign if you want to PM me ...but it's the Gideon's clothe that I feel is appropriate for these circumstances...




Hischild1994 -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (11/14/2005 12:06:46 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Giulia

The only great studies i have is my own life experiences.Many studies have been exausted in the mental health field and by no means do they have all the answers. I know adults who have add and I had it myself and sugar consumption certainly affected my concentration span and focusing ability. I have also had bipolar and food has also affected some of my highs and lows. So I have no links for you stateofgrace but I do have a lifetime experience and I do have a perception and I perceive that for me the only medication that has ever worked for me is the Grace of god and His goodness. The more His light shines on me the more i get healed,I'm not that big on keeping up with the reaserch about mental health because it always changes and they are all learning too just like me. What we need is more people of faith and more miracles!


I generally surround myself with people of faith.
I am on a low sugar diet due to being hypoglycemic.
I am bi-polar.

My amount of faith has no more to due with my being bi-polar than it does my being hypoglycemic.

According to my doctor, there is no known cause for bi-polar, but there is a study being done that suggests that it could be linked to unstable childhoods.




stateofgrace -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (11/14/2005 8:17:12 AM)

Well, hopefully the study will consider whether the childhoods were unstable due to parents with Bipolar, other mood disorders, or substance abuse, since there usually is a heriditary factor.




agapetos -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (11/14/2005 1:47:14 PM)

Unstable childhoods sound logical but don't explain why one child becomes bipolar and the other children in the family don't.




Hischild1994 -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (11/21/2005 3:10:35 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: agapetos

Unstable childhoods sound logical but don't explain why one child becomes bipolar and the other children in the family don't.



I think that genetics does also play a part in the issue.

Whether it would be genetic or due to childhood issues, it's not a guarantee that all members of the family will have the problem.

I had a neighbor who has Alzheimers. She was one of 6 children. Her father and a few of his siblings had Alzheimers, yet she is the only one in her family who has it. Genetics doesn't mean that you'll automatically get it either.

However, I do think that both can play a part.




womaninchrist -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (11/22/2005 4:27:21 PM)

Most of the research I've seen points to bipolar having a genetic component that requires an environmental trigger (usually some sort of severe and frequently prolonged stress or trauma - like an abusive childhood). They seem to think that's why it does appear to run in families but not every child will get it.




agapetos -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (11/23/2005 1:06:12 AM)

I think the important thing to remember with any mental health problem is that different things work for different people. It's probably important not to say a particular method doesn't work in general (though I have no problem someone saying it didn't work for them). I think it can really influence another individuals choice in trying something.

If I had no financial concerns there's a lot of methods I'd be trying ~ not to be cured, but to be able to better manage my condition.




SmileyTish -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (11/23/2005 4:02:18 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: womaninchrist

Most of the research I've seen points to bipolar having a genetic component that requires an environmental trigger (usually some sort of severe and frequently prolonged stress or trauma - like an abusive childhood). They seem to think that's why it does appear to run in families but not every child will get it.


Well, my husband was sexually assaulted as a child by a stranger then later by a good friend. He also started drinking so heavily as a teen that we think that also contributed to the chemical imbalance that occured.




stateofgrace -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (11/23/2005 4:12:33 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: womaninchrist

Most of the research I've seen points to bipolar having a genetic component that requires an environmental trigger (usually some sort of severe and frequently prolonged stress or trauma - like an abusive childhood). They seem to think that's why it does appear to run in families but not every child will get it.


I suspect the Early-Onset kids are less likely to have Bipolar triggered by prolonged stress, trauma, abuse, etc. In their case, many of them exhibit specific symptoms even from birth.




womaninchrist -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (11/23/2005 4:30:29 PM)

I'll be honest, I haven't seen much research about bipolar children. The research I'm familiar with speaks of theories about bipolar adults.

One other theory worth mention is a rather alternative one that speaks of environmental reaction. The theory is that as children (potentially very young ones) we pick up on environmental clues - like if parents have a lot of anger or anxiety to an extent that it creates a bit of instability in the home and learn to react to a non-normal situation as if it were normal and if this goes on long enough then we develop chemical or perhaps physical differences. And to be honest, this might be very true. Personally, I don't remember EVER being "normal" (I've had issues of anxiety, depression, irritability and lack of attention span since at least early childhood)...then again my homelife wasn't exactly normal either (very long and ugly story). I've got a lot of people in my family that are either very eccentric or known to be mentally ill, but then again if you look at my family's history the family isn't exactly known for being a healthy family or even remotely "functional" (my family's long and ugly story is the typical story for the overall family)...so who knows what it is in our case. I just know that at least half the family has a recognized mental illness or shows signs of being mentally ill.

Ultimately though, I don't think anyone knows how bipolar (or any other mental illness) actually happens - they know what it looks like, and might (or might not) be able to document functional abnormalities at a physical level...but I certainly haven't seen any theory that would for sure apply to all people with any known mental illness. I haven't seen any theories yet that I could safely say applies to even just to all of the bipolars that I personally know.




stateofgrace -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (11/23/2005 7:14:19 PM)

I've seen some discussion as to whether or not Early-Onset Bipolar and Bipolar that hits teens and adults is the same thing. They share symptoms in common, but other symptoms typical for the kids alone and teens/adults alone. Sort of like the discussion on whether Aspergers and Autism are part of a "spectrum" or two different but somewhat similar disorders.




womaninchrist -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (11/23/2005 8:23:35 PM)

And that points to some good examples of how psychiatry is a soft-science. Much of psychiatry is largely guesswork and theory. There's debate as to whether child-onset bipolar and adult-onset are the same (as you mentioned), debate as to whether perhaps ADD/ADHD are part of the bipolar spectrum and debate that, perhaps, ADD/ADHD are really just misdiagnosed bipolar (though perhaps milder bipolar or the early stages of bipolar). Then there's schizoaffective, I've had psychiatrists tell me it's a form of schizophrenia, others say it's a very psychosis-prone form of bipolar and still others say it's elements of both. Huh? Can't they at least agree on the basics?




stateofgrace -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (11/24/2005 2:31:37 AM)

I wouldn't personally consider psychiatry a soft-science, just that we are at a point where research has finally begun to uncover a lot of specifics about how the brain works...but we still have a lot to learn. Brain scanning technology, studies of genetics, etc....it's all adding pieces of the puzzle, we're just still missing some significant pieces.

A person with Bipolar Disorder, or a parent of a child with Asperger's, as two examples, often can't "afford" to wait till we have all the answers.

As far as the ADD/Bipolar thing, I personally think the explination that makes the most sense is that Early Onset Bipolar has been misdiagnosed as ADD for a good number of kids. This situation happened with our daughter.

Then the typical kid who has this misdiagnosis goes ballistic on ADD medication, and often gets put on an anti-depressant for the down/irritiable side of the mood swings, which shoots them over into the mania side more frequently (with Early-Onset, extremely rapid cycling is common). Not a pleasant experience, believe me. From the time I spent on the Child and Adolescent Bipolar Association site, I know that many other parents had this experience as well. And from their research, Dennis and Janice Paplos, the doctor and nurse that have done much to bring childhood Bipolar into focus in the last decade, discovered that this was a frequently occuring situation. This is why they recommend getting the mood disorder stabilized before considering ADD medication, if there is evidence that a mood disorder exists.

Up till recently, doctors "understood" ADD more then they understood Early-Onset Bipolar, because they were more familiar with ADD, although that is slowly changing. And, hypomania in a 4 to 6 year old looks a lot like hyperactivity. Looking back at some home videos when my daughter was that age, it really seems obvious in hindsight. But it wasn't obvious at the time.

There's some different stuff going on in the brain of someone who has "typical" ADD vs. someone who has "typical" Bipoar, either first being diagnosed in adolescence or later, or the Early-Onset type. I know Daniel Amen has identified a frequently occurring brain pattern he calls "Ring of Fire" which he first put as a subcategory of ADD, but he's appeared to move positionally that it might be more along the lines of a mood disorder.

Like with later-onset Bipolar, many Bipolar kids are able to stabilize very well on medication, once the right combination of medication for them is found. I tend to say that my daughter is 90-95% of what would be considered in a normal range as far as mood swings right now. That's a big improvement from where she was at 10 or 11. She's living a "normal" life now because a treatment was available that would stabilize her mood swings.

Teens wtih Bipolar Disorder are at high risk for suicide, and for extreme risk-taking destructive behavior. My daughter, praise God, is not struggling with either issue. OTOH, and this is JUST anedotal, but I have a friend whose son was not treated till late in his teen years (another misdiagnosis) and he's attempted suicide twice, the second time after going off meds in college. So one thing I have treally tried to hammer in with my daughter is that this is a chronic condition, and any changes in medication need to be closely supervised by a doctor, and done with personal accountability to someone. She understands chronic medical conditions because she had asthma as a young child, and at 12 her sister still has it.

I have a theory as to why we're seeing more kids with serious brain-related problems, too...beyond just using research to identify patterns occuring in many kids. Not wanting to get into something that might be considered social Darwinism, but I think that in the last few decades, cultural changes and advances in medicine have enabled more people with their own mental health problems to bear and raise children. Since there is a genetic link with many of these disorders, I think we've got more people bearing more children who are vulnerable to these disorders. As one rather simplistic example, in the day where a woman depended on a man to support her, she was less likely to look at a man that might have potential problems in taking on those responsibilities as a prospective mate.




womaninchrist -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (11/24/2005 1:01:56 PM)

You might be onto something with the societal thing. I know that one side of my family has a long history of things like hatred, greed, manupulativeness and bitterness and that it's often led to abusive behavior against friends, associates and family - oddly enough that side of the family has an incredibly high rate of mental illness (high enough even psychiatrists have been rather confused as to why - even when they believe it's a gentic thing) and it's strong mental illnesses (schizophrenia, schizoaffective, and a very psychosis prone version of bipolar). Almost 70% of that side of the family in any generation either has a documented mental illness or family history shows enough symptoms that they would have been diagnosed with one had they ever seen a psychiatrist. Of course, this kind of lands you at a version of the chicken or the egg question...

By the time you get to me, all they can really figure out is that I "don't function normally, most likely due to long-term effects of childhood events" and that this seems to be at the root of what's become a very lengthy diagnosis.

I'd love to have Dr. Amen look into things, I've often heard his clinics recommended (and especially so for people with complex diagnoses where none of the standard treatments seem to work). However, the Amen clinics are way outside my budget...




WesP -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (11/29/2005 3:32:26 PM)

I tend to believe that the gene pool is increasingly corrupt, thus contributing to the increase in these mental disorders. I also believe that societal judgments perpetuate many "false" cases. I know from personal experience that some children and adults that were diagnosed as ADD, ADHD, etc. were simply lacking any self-discipline. Also, I have seen individuals seek a negative diagnosis before they would declare that they were "properly" diagnosed. Sometimes these individuals would visit a dozen doctors before they were satisfied.

All this being said, I do not doubt that many people are correctly diagnosed. I just think that the problems are not quite as rampant as they are portrayed.




Illuminati -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (11/30/2005 9:58:48 PM)

I have social phobia, and want to get rid of it badly. I have noticed that drinking alcohol and being sleep deprived isn't a solution at all. Can anyone testify that God, the teachings of Jesus Christ and Christ himself can heal social phobia, or any type of depression? Does anyone know of someone (or perhaps this has happened to you) where God has taken your depression and social phobia? Thanks a lot. :(




Pinksultana -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (12/1/2005 7:49:59 PM)

Man Im having a bad day today....I suffered from clinical depression for four years and was on medication, and then I beleive I was released from the mental illness by Gods grace...but every now and then I wake up having a really bad day feeling like the old days...it takes everything I have to fight the depression and pray it away...but today I am having a rough time and Im so thankful this thread is here so I can share that.

Have you ever felt isolated in a room full of people? Or overwhelmed by life because you need to do one errand? Or so unsure of who you are that you look in the mirror and it actually feels weird to see your face because it feels like youve never really seen it before?
Its so hard to explain but on these bad days all I can think about is longing for nothingness...scared to die or live... I long for a new life but I dont want to do anything...it sounds lazy but it not that...its just an inescapable sadness

dont get me wrong I love God and have a relationship with him, but on these days it takes so much to hold onto him....

thanks for listening




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